Readyboost and IDE CompactFlash

Mark Gillespie · External Since: Feb 28, 2006 Posts: 208

I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however I
can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?

Thanks

--
------------------------------------
http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
------------------------------------

Richard G. Harper · External Since: Sep 09, 2006 Posts: 1406

Probably not.

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"Mark Gillespie" <mark.gillespie RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:op.tkdp7dduj2q9yy@vistadesktop64.draytek...
>I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however I
>can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?

Mark Gillespie · External Since: Feb 28, 2006 Posts: 208

On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 10:36:47 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper.DeleteThis@email.com>
wrote:

> Probably not.
>

But I can use the same CF flash card via USB? Shurely this is wrong? IDE
is lower latency..

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Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Richard G. Harper · External Since: Sep 09, 2006 Posts: 1406

I doubt it's "wrong" - why would you want to use an IDE device for
ReadyBoost when in theory it would/could be used as a direct IDE device? I
suspect this is simply a teeny-tiny niche product that no one anticipated
and therefore did not support.

--
Richard G. Harper [MVP Shell/User] rgharper DeleteThis @gmail.com
* NEW! Catch my blog ... http://msmvps.com/blogs/rgharper/
* PLEASE post all messages and replies in the newsgroups
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"Mark Gillespie" <mark.gillespie DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:op.tker42qmj2q9yy@vista-laptop.draytek...
> On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 10:36:47 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper DeleteThis @email.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Probably not.
>>
>
> But I can use the same CF flash card via USB? Shurely this is wrong? IDE
> is lower latency..
>
> --
> Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Mark Gillespie · External Since: Feb 28, 2006 Posts: 208

On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:04:16 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper RemoveThis @email.com>
wrote:

> I doubt it's "wrong" - why would you want to use an IDE device for
> ReadyBoost when in theory it would/could be used as a direct IDE
> device? I
> suspect this is simply a teeny-tiny niche product that no one anticipated
> and therefore did not support.
>

I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....

--
------------------------------------
http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
------------------------------------

Richard G. Harper · External Since: Sep 09, 2006 Posts: 1406

Sorry, but apparently using IDE to provide it is. Good luck in your search.

--
Richard G. Harper [MVP Shell/User] rgharper.DeleteThis@gmail.com
* NEW! Catch my blog ... http://msmvps.com/blogs/rgharper/
* PLEASE post all messages and replies in the newsgroups
* The Website - http://rgharper.mvps.org/
* HELP us help YOU ... http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm

"Mark Gillespie" <mark.gillespie.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:op.tkfruqgyj2q9yy@vistadesktop64.draytek...
> On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:04:16 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper.DeleteThis@email.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I doubt it's "wrong" - why would you want to use an IDE device for
>> ReadyBoost when in theory it would/could be used as a direct IDE device?
>> I
>> suspect this is simply a teeny-tiny niche product that no one anticipated
>> and therefore did not support.
>>
>
> I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
> Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------
> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> ------------------------------------

Tom Lake · External Since: Feb 26, 2006 Posts: 407

> I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
> Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....

Look at an IDE card that provides USB ports. I have one that has a
USB socket on the inside as well as four externally available ones.
You could keep a pen drive plugged in there inside your computer.

Tom Lake

Robert Moir · External Since: Nov 24, 2006 Posts: 445

Mark Gillespie wrote:
> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter,
> however I can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able
> to?

No, and you don't really need or want to.

Think about what readyboost actually does:
(http://blogs.msdn.com/tomarcher/archive/2006/06/02/615199.aspx)

It creates a 'cache' of your virtual memory onto a usb key because the
access time is faster than that of a typical hard drive where you'd normally
find virtual memory.

If you have a device that connects natively via an IDE interface but works
at fast flash memory speed, caching virtual memory file from your hard disk
offers you nothing that cannot be served at least as well, if not better, by
simply creating the virtual memory swap file onto your flash memory IDE
device.

Rob Moir

hdc4hotmailcom · External Since: Dec 15, 2006 Posts: 1

I've been able to use SD flash memory cards for ready bost on my laptop's
internal card reader. I just leave the card in all the time (just make sure
your card is one of the newer ones with a fast read/write time). Much cheaper
than upgrading the ram (but not necessarily as good)

also, leaving a jump-drive sticking out the side of the laptop for this IS a
huge annoyance-

"Robert Moir" wrote:

> Mark Gillespie wrote:
> > I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter,
> > however I can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able
> > to?
>
> No, and you don't really need or want to.
>
> Think about what readyboost actually does:
> (http://blogs.msdn.com/tomarcher/archive/2006/06/02/615199.aspx)
>
> It creates a 'cache' of your virtual memory onto a usb key because the
> access time is faster than that of a typical hard drive where you'd normally
> find virtual memory.
>
> If you have a device that connects natively via an IDE interface but works
> at fast flash memory speed, caching virtual memory file from your hard disk
> offers you nothing that cannot be served at least as well, if not better, by
> simply creating the virtual memory swap file onto your flash memory IDE
> device.
>
> Rob Moir
>
>
>

Matt S. · External Since: Dec 21, 2006 Posts: 1

There will be such a device.. When Hybrid HDD's come on to the market(dont
know for sure they have already or not) it will have a certain amount of
flash memory inside the HD that will beable to serve as permanent
readyboost. But, unfortunately it will only be permanent as long as you dont
lose power..

--
Matt S. (1033709)
Windows Live Butterfly
Windows Vista RTM

"Mark Gillespie" <mark.gillespie.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:op.tkfruqgyj2q9yy@vistadesktop64.draytek...
> On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:04:16 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper.TakeThisOut@email.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I doubt it's "wrong" - why would you want to use an IDE device for
>> ReadyBoost when in theory it would/could be used as a direct IDE device?
>> I
>> suspect this is simply a teeny-tiny niche product that no one anticipated
>> and therefore did not support.
>>
>
> I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
> Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------
> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> ------------------------------------

MIke M · External Since: Dec 27, 2006 Posts: 1

I have a 60x speed SD 1 GB card - ReadyBoost won't accept it when place in
the Toshiba laptop built in SD slot. However, this card does seem to work
with ready boost when inserted into my USB 2.0 card reader. So, I guess that
means the Toshiba internal card reader slot itself is not fast enough? None
of my other cards appear to be "fast cards" and don't support ReadyBoost in
either card reader location . . . .

Thanks,

Mike

"hdc4@hotmail.com" wrote:

> I've been able to use SD flash memory cards for ready bost on my laptop's
> internal card reader. I just leave the card in all the time (just make sure
> your card is one of the newer ones with a fast read/write time). Much cheaper
> than upgrading the ram (but not necessarily as good)
>
> also, leaving a jump-drive sticking out the side of the laptop for this IS a
> huge annoyance-
>
> "Robert Moir" wrote:
>
> > Mark Gillespie wrote:
> > > I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter,
> > > however I can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able
> > > to?
> >
> > No, and you don't really need or want to.
> >
> > Think about what readyboost actually does:
> > (http://blogs.msdn.com/tomarcher/archive/2006/06/02/615199.aspx)
> >
> > It creates a 'cache' of your virtual memory onto a usb key because the
> > access time is faster than that of a typical hard drive where you'd normally
> > find virtual memory.
> >
> > If you have a device that connects natively via an IDE interface but works
> > at fast flash memory speed, caching virtual memory file from your hard disk
> > offers you nothing that cannot be served at least as well, if not better, by
> > simply creating the virtual memory swap file onto your flash memory IDE
> > device.
> >
> > Rob Moir
> >
> >
> >

wayoung56 · External Since: Feb 14, 2007 Posts: 2

I recently purchased a Toshiba Laptop with Windows Vista Home Premium. I
noticed the ReadyBoost capability the first time I inserted a Sandisk 2GB USB
Drive, so I started investigating. After reading several "Googled" pages on
the web, I decided that a CompactFlash Card in a PCMCIA adaptor would be an
ideal situation, much better than leaving a USB drive sticking out the side
or back of the laptop.

I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't work. I
guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so I
broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it didn't
work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick it in an
external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the internal
adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.

Is this works as designed or something Microsoft needs to address in the
future?

"Mark Gillespie" wrote:

> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however I
> can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> ------------------------------------
> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> ------------------------------------
>

AJR · External Since: Apr 07, 2006 Posts: 537

What does Event Viewer document? Go Admin tools>Event viewer>Adm and
Services>Microsoft>Windows>Readyboost>Operational

Could be that the USB 2.0 bus is faster than the built-in slot.

"wayoung56" <wayoung56.TakeThisOut@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:9DEE4E46-E6B0-4B8E-B7DE-AC8E7B6F7B3F@microsoft.com...
>I recently purchased a Toshiba Laptop with Windows Vista Home Premium. I
> noticed the ReadyBoost capability the first time I inserted a Sandisk 2GB
> USB
> Drive, so I started investigating. After reading several "Googled" pages
> on
> the web, I decided that a CompactFlash Card in a PCMCIA adaptor would be
> an
> ideal situation, much better than leaving a USB drive sticking out the
> side
> or back of the laptop.
>
> I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't work.
> I
> guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so I
> broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it
> didn't
> work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick it in
> an
> external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the internal
> adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.
>
> Is this works as designed or something Microsoft needs to address in the
> future?
>
> "Mark Gillespie" wrote:
>
>> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however I
>> can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> --
>> ------------------------------------
>> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
>> ------------------------------------
>>

wayoung56 · External Since: Feb 14, 2007 Posts: 2

Here's what the log entry reads after I insert the CF card in the adaptor:

The device (Unknown Unknown) will not be used for a ReadyBoost cache because
it is not attached to a supported interface.

When I insert the same CD card in an external USB Card Reader, the log entry
reads:

The device (Generic STORAGE DEVICE) is suitable for a ReadyBoost cache. The
recommended cache size is 1890304KB. The random read speed is 3012 KB/sec.
The sequential write speed is 2509 KB/sec.

and the next log entry reads:

A ReadyBoost cache was successfully created on the device (Generic STORAGE
DEVICE) of size 1840 MB.

Does this mean we need to ask Microsoft to build support into the Operating
System for devices attached to the PCMCIA bus in addition to the USB bus?

Thanks for the information!!!

"AJR" wrote:

> What does Event Viewer document? Go Admin tools>Event viewer>Adm and
> Services>Microsoft>Windows>Readyboost>Operational
>
> Could be that the USB 2.0 bus is faster than the built-in slot.
>
> "wayoung56" <wayoung56 DeleteThis @discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:9DEE4E46-E6B0-4B8E-B7DE-AC8E7B6F7B3F@microsoft.com...
> >I recently purchased a Toshiba Laptop with Windows Vista Home Premium. I
> > noticed the ReadyBoost capability the first time I inserted a Sandisk 2GB
> > USB
> > Drive, so I started investigating. After reading several "Googled" pages
> > on
> > the web, I decided that a CompactFlash Card in a PCMCIA adaptor would be
> > an
> > ideal situation, much better than leaving a USB drive sticking out the
> > side
> > or back of the laptop.
> >
> > I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't work.
> > I
> > guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so I
> > broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it
> > didn't
> > work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick it in
> > an
> > external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the internal
> > adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.
> >
> > Is this works as designed or something Microsoft needs to address in the
> > future?
> >
> > "Mark Gillespie" wrote:
> >
> >> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however I
> >> can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >> --
> >> ------------------------------------
> >> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> >> ------------------------------------
> >>
>
>
>

AJR · External Since: Apr 07, 2006 Posts: 537

You got it! Some interesting facts - Vista creates a "ReadyBoost cache"
whether or not a ReadyBoost device is attached - evidently this cache
permits removal of the device without loss of data -data is duplicated
(performance?) - data moved to the ReadyBoost device is encrypted in case
data is left on the device when removed.
Also confusion exists about ReadyBoost. At times there will be posts
regarding notice that after "activating" ReadyBoost there is no increase of
RAM indicated. ReadyBoost does not boost or increase RAM - it is an external
memory device that increases (boosts) the "prefetch function" (Vista
Superfetch) of the swap file.

\

@
"AJR" <ajrjdr.TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:OZuh6hHUHHA.4796@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> What does Event Viewer document? Go Admin tools>Event viewer>Adm and
> Services>Microsoft>Windows>Readyboost>Operational
>
> Could be that the USB 2.0 bus is faster than the built-in slot.
>
> "wayoung56" <wayoung56.TakeThisOut@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:9DEE4E46-E6B0-4B8E-B7DE-AC8E7B6F7B3F@microsoft.com...
>>I recently purchased a Toshiba Laptop with Windows Vista Home Premium. I
>> noticed the ReadyBoost capability the first time I inserted a Sandisk 2GB
>> USB
>> Drive, so I started investigating. After reading several "Googled" pages
>> on
>> the web, I decided that a CompactFlash Card in a PCMCIA adaptor would be
>> an
>> ideal situation, much better than leaving a USB drive sticking out the
>> side
>> or back of the laptop.
>>
>> I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't work.
>> I
>> guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so I
>> broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it
>> didn't
>> work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick it
>> in an
>> external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the internal
>> adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.
>>
>> Is this works as designed or something Microsoft needs to address in the
>> future?
>>
>> "Mark Gillespie" wrote:
>>
>>> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter, however
>>> I
>>> can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> --
>>> ------------------------------------
>>> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>
>
>

Kevin Young · External Since: Feb 14, 2007 Posts: 9

My understanding is that the PCMCIA interface is to slow to allow for
ReadyBoost compatibility. The Expresscard interface has been added to
many recent laptops and is much faster. I wasn't even aware that my
laptop had an Expresscard port until a week ago because from the outside
it look just like two PCMCIA slots. I was planning to go the same route
as you and read elsewhere that PCMCIA would not work which led me to
Expresscard and then to realising I had one built-in.

-----Original Message-----
From: wayoung56 [mailto:wayoung56@discussions.microsoft.com]
Posted At: February-14-07 2:53 PM
Posted To: microsoft.public.windows.vista.performance_maintenance
Conversation: Readyboost and IDE CompactFlash
Subject: Re: Readyboost and IDE CompactFlash

Here's what the log entry reads after I insert the CF card in the adaptor:

The device (Unknown Unknown) will not be used for a ReadyBoost cache
because
it is not attached to a supported interface.

When I insert the same CD card in an external USB Card Reader, the log
entry
reads:

The device (Generic STORAGE DEVICE) is suitable for a ReadyBoost cache.
The
recommended cache size is 1890304KB. The random read speed is 3012
KB/sec.
The sequential write speed is 2509 KB/sec.

and the next log entry reads:

A ReadyBoost cache was successfully created on the device (Generic STORAGE
DEVICE) of size 1840 MB.

Does this mean we need to ask Microsoft to build support into the
Operating
System for devices attached to the PCMCIA bus in addition to the USB bus?

Thanks for the information!!!

"AJR" wrote:

> What does Event Viewer document? Go Admin tools>Event viewer>Adm and
> Services>Microsoft>Windows>Readyboost>Operational
>
> Could be that the USB 2.0 bus is faster than the built-in slot.
>
> "wayoung56" <wayoung56.DeleteThis@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:9DEE4E46-E6B0-4B8E-B7DE-AC8E7B6F7B3F@microsoft.com...
> >I recently purchased a Toshiba Laptop with Windows Vista Home Premium.
> >I
> > noticed the ReadyBoost capability the first time I inserted a Sandisk
> > 2GB
> > USB
> > Drive, so I started investigating. After reading several "Googled"
> > pages
> > on
> > the web, I decided that a CompactFlash Card in a PCMCIA adaptor would
> > be
> > an
> > ideal situation, much better than leaving a USB drive sticking out the
> > side
> > or back of the laptop.
> >
> > I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't
> > work.
> > I
> > guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so
> > I
> > broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it
> > didn't
> > work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick
> > it in
> > an
> > external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the
> > internal
> > adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.
> >
> > Is this works as designed or something Microsoft needs to address in
> > the
> > future?
> >
> > "Mark Gillespie" wrote:
> >
> >> I have a 1GB Compact Flash card, and a IDE Internal CF adapter,
> >> however I
> >> can't get this running with ReadyBoost. Should I be able to?
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >> --
> >> ------------------------------------
> >> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> >> ------------------------------------
> >>
>
>
>

"cquirke · External Since: Feb 11, 2007 Posts: 560

On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:15:30 -0800, wayoung56

>I had an existing 512MB CF card in a PCMCIA adaptor, and it didn't work. I
>guessed it wasn't fast or large enough to pass the ReadyBoost test. so I
>broke down and bought a faster Sandisk 2GB Ultra II CF card. And it didn't
>work either - lol. The strange thing is, it works fine if you stick it in an
>external USB 2.0 based card reader. When I stick it back in the internal
>adaptor, it is not recognized as being ReadyBoost capable again.

Perhaps the PCMCIA bus is too slow? Let's search that... no that
should be OK, as worst-case data rate appears to be around 4Ms,
whereas flash drives are typically under 1Ms.

There may be other reasons why PCMCIA isn't an acceptable interface to
SD cards or USB flash drives; other latencies, related overheads, or
just that it's a dying standard that isn't worth developing a new
feature to use. I'd use the card reader, and move on; if buying a new
laptop, I'd want one with a native SD card slot (as is common now)

>--------------- ---- --- -- - - - -
Saws are too hard to use.
Be easier to use!
>--------------- ---- --- -- - - - -

NormD · External Since: Feb 20, 2007 Posts: 2

I had the same thought. Supported memory need not be a USB "pen." In a new
machine I installed a USB-based card reader and stuck in a fast (150x) 4 GB
SD memory card. If you really want to hide it, put the USB port inside the
case and plug in the memory and leave it!

"Mark Gillespie" wrote:

> On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:04:16 -0000, Richard G. Harper <rgharper.DeleteThis@email.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I doubt it's "wrong" - why would you want to use an IDE device for
> > ReadyBoost when in theory it would/could be used as a direct IDE
> > device? I
> > suspect this is simply a teeny-tiny niche product that no one anticipated
> > and therefore did not support.
> >
>
> I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
> Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------
> http:\\www.rockhangouts.com
> ------------------------------------
>

n4wi · External Since: Jul 09, 2007 Posts: 10

Why should it hang out the front? Why not the back, if you don't have a USB
on the back get a 2 port USB Bracket and up plug one or two of the front ones
and put it in the back. I have a 4 Ghz in the back and it works great and you
don't see it from the front.
Fred

"Tom Lake" wrote:

> > I want a permenent Readyboost, internal in my PC, not an Ugly USB Pen
> > Drive hanging out the front, that's not a very niche chain of thought....
>
>
> Look at an IDE card that provides USB ports. I have one that has a
> USB socket on the inside as well as four externally available ones.
> You could keep a pen drive plugged in there inside your computer.
>
> Tom Lake

RedSpy · External Since: Jul 29, 2007 Posts: 5

I too am looking at the following scenarios:
-Buy a 8 GB 266x Compact Flash with and IDE adapter for use with ReadyBoost
on my PC
--This is $155 total.
-Buy a high speed ExpressCard SSD drive for my laptopâ€™s use

I think it is a very reasonable request for ReadyBoost to work on this
hardware configuration if ReadyBoost is considered a hard drive cache
mechanism. Surely there is some way to force Vista to use these devices.