Orphan Control with Frames

Rick · External Since: Apr 21, 2006 Posts: 113

Using Word 2003, whenever I try to use frames for images in my document,
orphan/widow control no longer works. That is, if I have a paragraph that
starts near a figure at the bottom of the page or ends near a figure at the
top of a page, Word will gladly allow a widow or orphan line, even though
that option is checked. Additionally, frames seems to make Word ignore other
paragraph flow operators like "Keep with next."
Are there any work-arounds? For now I've just been playing with the length
of paragraphs manually by adjusting spacing between sections etc. to prevent
single lines. But I'd like a long-term automatic solution.
Please don't suggest using in-line images. I need images at the top or
bottom of a page regardless of whether I'm between paragraphs, and I'm not
interested in faking it by manually splitting paragraphs.
Thanks

Stefan Blom · External Since: Jun 18, 2007 Posts: 44

Word seems to have difficulties handling this correctly. I don't know of a
workaround other than the ones you have already mentioned.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

"Rick" wrote:

> Using Word 2003, whenever I try to use frames for images in my document,
> orphan/widow control no longer works. That is, if I have a paragraph that
> starts near a figure at the bottom of the page or ends near a figure at the
> top of a page, Word will gladly allow a widow or orphan line, even though
> that option is checked. Additionally, frames seems to make Word ignore other
> paragraph flow operators like "Keep with next."
> Are there any work-arounds? For now I've just been playing with the length
> of paragraphs manually by adjusting spacing between sections etc. to prevent
> single lines. But I'd like a long-term automatic solution.
> Please don't suggest using in-line images. I need images at the top or
> bottom of a page regardless of whether I'm between paragraphs, and I'm not
> interested in faking it by manually splitting paragraphs.
> Thanks

Suzanne S. Barnhill · External Since: Sep 26, 2003 Posts: 24065

I think Word has trouble calculating line lengths next to frames and bases
its page breaks on where the line breaks would be if the frame were not
there. I noticed this many years ago when I was using stationery that had a
frame creating an artificially wide left margin on the first page and
decided it was something I'd just have to live with, though of course it's
not ideal.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Stefan Blom" <StefanBlom DeleteThis @discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:32E178E5-6077-4B84-9FB0-0DB2DA61A30D@microsoft.com...
> Word seems to have difficulties handling this correctly. I don't know of a
> workaround other than the ones you have already mentioned.
>
> --
> Stefan Blom
> Microsoft Word MVP
>
>
>
>
> "Rick" wrote:
>
>> Using Word 2003, whenever I try to use frames for images in my document,
>> orphan/widow control no longer works. That is, if I have a paragraph that
>> starts near a figure at the bottom of the page or ends near a figure at
>> the
>> top of a page, Word will gladly allow a widow or orphan line, even though
>> that option is checked. Additionally, frames seems to make Word ignore
>> other
>> paragraph flow operators like "Keep with next."
>> Are there any work-arounds? For now I've just been playing with the
>> length
>> of paragraphs manually by adjusting spacing between sections etc. to
>> prevent
>> single lines. But I'd like a long-term automatic solution.
>> Please don't suggest using in-line images. I need images at the top or
>> bottom of a page regardless of whether I'm between paragraphs, and I'm
>> not
>> interested in faking it by manually splitting paragraphs.
>> Thanks
>

Stefan Blom · External Since: May 08, 2009 Posts: 214

Thank you for the explanation, which certainly sounds likely (but it's still
annoying).

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" <sbarnhill DeleteThis @mvps.org> wrote in message
news:efAvY7AVKHA.220@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>I think Word has trouble calculating line lengths next to frames and bases
>its page breaks on where the line breaks would be if the frame were not
>there. I noticed this many years ago when I was using stationery that had a
>frame creating an artificially wide left margin on the first page and
>decided it was something I'd just have to live with, though of course it's
>not ideal.
>
> --
> Suzanne S. Barnhill
> Microsoft MVP (Word)
> Words into Type
> Fairhope, Alabama USA
> http://word.mvps.org
>
> "Stefan Blom" <StefanBlom DeleteThis @discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:32E178E5-6077-4B84-9FB0-0DB2DA61A30D@microsoft.com...
>> Word seems to have difficulties handling this correctly. I don't know of
>> a
>> workaround other than the ones you have already mentioned.
>>
>> --
>> Stefan Blom
>> Microsoft Word MVP
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Rick" wrote:
>>
>>> Using Word 2003, whenever I try to use frames for images in my document,
>>> orphan/widow control no longer works. That is, if I have a paragraph
>>> that
>>> starts near a figure at the bottom of the page or ends near a figure at
>>> the
>>> top of a page, Word will gladly allow a widow or orphan line, even
>>> though
>>> that option is checked. Additionally, frames seems to make Word ignore
>>> other
>>> paragraph flow operators like "Keep with next."
>>> Are there any work-arounds? For now I've just been playing with the
>>> length
>>> of paragraphs manually by adjusting spacing between sections etc. to
>>> prevent
>>> single lines. But I'd like a long-term automatic solution.
>>> Please don't suggest using in-line images. I need images at the top or
>>> bottom of a page regardless of whether I'm between paragraphs, and I'm
>>> not
>>> interested in faking it by manually splitting paragraphs.
>>> Thanks
>>
>

Suzanne S. Barnhill · External Since: Sep 26, 2003 Posts: 24065

IIRC, it's very apparent if you view the page in Normal view (where frames
are not in place); the line breaks of course are different since the lines
are wrapping to full margin width, and you can see that Word thinks there
will be two lines before a page break where there in fact is only one
(because lines above, wrapping shorter, have pushed the text down).

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Stefan Blom" <StefanBlom RemoveThis @discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:ejTzuDBVKHA.1268@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> Thank you for the explanation, which certainly sounds likely (but it's
> still annoying).
>
> --
> Stefan Blom
> Microsoft Word MVP
>
>
>
> "Suzanne S. Barnhill" <sbarnhill RemoveThis @mvps.org> wrote in message
> news:efAvY7AVKHA.220@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>>I think Word has trouble calculating line lengths next to frames and bases
>>its page breaks on where the line breaks would be if the frame were not
>>there. I noticed this many years ago when I was using stationery that had
>>a frame creating an artificially wide left margin on the first page and
>>decided it was something I'd just have to live with, though of course it's
>>not ideal.
>>
>> --
>> Suzanne S. Barnhill
>> Microsoft MVP (Word)
>> Words into Type
>> Fairhope, Alabama USA
>> http://word.mvps.org
>>
>> "Stefan Blom" <StefanBlom RemoveThis @discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:32E178E5-6077-4B84-9FB0-0DB2DA61A30D@microsoft.com...
>>> Word seems to have difficulties handling this correctly. I don't know of
>>> a
>>> workaround other than the ones you have already mentioned.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Stefan Blom
>>> Microsoft Word MVP
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Rick" wrote:
>>>
>>>> Using Word 2003, whenever I try to use frames for images in my
>>>> document,
>>>> orphan/widow control no longer works. That is, if I have a paragraph
>>>> that
>>>> starts near a figure at the bottom of the page or ends near a figure at
>>>> the
>>>> top of a page, Word will gladly allow a widow or orphan line, even
>>>> though
>>>> that option is checked. Additionally, frames seems to make Word ignore
>>>> other
>>>> paragraph flow operators like "Keep with next."
>>>> Are there any work-arounds? For now I've just been playing with the
>>>> length
>>>> of paragraphs manually by adjusting spacing between sections etc. to
>>>> prevent
>>>> single lines. But I'd like a long-term automatic solution.
>>>> Please don't suggest using in-line images. I need images at the top or
>>>> bottom of a page regardless of whether I'm between paragraphs, and I'm
>>>> not
>>>> interested in faking it by manually splitting paragraphs.
>>>> Thanks
>>>
>>
>
>
>