'The Prime of Miss Jean Brodie' (1969)

calvin · External Since: Feb 07, 2009 Posts: 505

On Saturday, March 17, 2012 7:12:17 PM UTC-4, David Oberman wrote:
> Poor Bubba. You know how wet he got just now, Tom? We had a downpour.
> Our streets are like rivers. Bubba is sopping and he's NOT happy.

Now five posts in a row from you over a seven minute period,
and all five 'flagged for abuse'.

Howard Brazee · External Since: Sep 25, 2005 Posts: 1419

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 01:09:38 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>But my point is that in abuse of the teacher-student
>relationship, it's not a question of passing judgement
>on the teacher's psychology or morality, but rather on
>his criminal behavior. I don't care that he's a lech.
>I care that he abused students.

I don't know what the letter of the law was at that place and time, so
to me it's not about criminal behavior.

But the morals and values I found to be most interesting were the more
ambiguous ones of Miss Brodie.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

Howard Brazee · External Since: Sep 25, 2005 Posts: 1419

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 16:07:39 -0700, David O.
wrote:

>
>>That's preposterous. How many Republican racists you figure there are
>>in the US? They wouldn't deny someone a vote? Please be serious.
>
>I'm against allowing non-citizens to vote.

I'm against allowing non-citizens to give to any political campaign.
Even if the Supreme Court says they are people.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

gtr · External Since: Feb 17, 2010 Posts: 155

On 2012-03-17 22:57:52 +0000, calvin said:

> On Saturday, March 17, 2012 4:22:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> [quoting Wikipedia]
>> "Evidence of voter fraud was never substantiated on a large or
>> organized scale in states that enacted no voter ID laws. ?In 2007, a
>> report prepared by the staff of the federal Election Assistance
>> Commission found that, among experts, "there is widespread but not
>> unanimous agreement that there is little polling place fraud".[20] The
>> report was based on research conducted by a Republican elections
>> lawyer and another expert with liberal leanings."[20]
>> ...
>
> Of course there is no evidence. The whole point of
> allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence
> of the fraud.

There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud. There is no
evidence of a bus in your driveway--there's no reason to write laws to
keep one out of your driveway.

We have humans that register, they are validated at that time. Then
they vote--only once. If they vote more than once it's fraud. If they
try to vote and have no registration, they are disallowed. What kind of
fraud is it that imply leaves no evidence?

Among the sciences, (all of which are no considered liberal plots),
there is statistics. This particular science indicates there is no
fraud. What reason would there be to write legislation to carefully
overcome activity Whatthat is not happening? The converse argument
against "not statistically significant" is--what?

> At least where I live we have common sense. When
> I go to the polling place, which is run by both
> black and white people, male and female, I have to
> show an ID (driver's licence in my case). My name
> is checked against the list of registered voters, and
> checked off. Then I vote. I would be laughed out of
> the place if I said I shouldn't have to give an ID.

But it doesn't have to be a picture ID.

> Why do you not want a simple common-sense procedure
> like that, unless you have Democrat fraud in mind?

Why do you want to demand a "special" ID, if not to limit the vote to
those who don't have them, more frequently poorer people and people of
color which frequently don't have a driver's licence.
--
I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
-- Galileo

gtr · External Since: Feb 17, 2010 Posts: 155

On 2012-03-17 23:10:18 +0000, David O. said:

> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 12:01:35 -0700 (PDT), Tom wrote:
>
>> Even though Santorum has vowed to curtail your constitutional rights?
>
> If Santorum wins the presidency, it'll be a disaster for civil rights,
> civil progress, and my efforts to eliminate crony capitalism,
> corporatism, and rampaging statism.

Why, what legislation does he intend to beg the Republcian congress to
enact that the Democrat majority won't disallow, or that the minority
won't fillibuster?
--
I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
-- Galileo

calvin · External Since: Feb 07, 2009 Posts: 505

On Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:52:50 PM UTC-4, gtr wrote:
> On 2012-03-17 22:57:52 +0000, calvin said:
>
> > On Saturday, March 17, 2012 4:22:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> >> [quoting Wikipedia]
> >> "Evidence of voter fraud was never substantiated on a large or
> >> organized scale in states that enacted no voter ID laws. ?In 2007, a
> >> report prepared by the staff of the federal Election Assistance
> >> Commission found that, among experts, "there is widespread but not
> >> unanimous agreement that there is little polling place fraud".[20] The
> >> report was based on research conducted by a Republican elections
> >> lawyer and another expert with liberal leanings."[20]
> >> ...
> >
> > Of course there is no evidence. The whole point of
> > allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence
> > of the fraud.
>
> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.

Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.

> There is no
> evidence of a bus in your driveway--there's no reason to write laws to
> keep one out of your driveway.
>
> We have humans that register, they are validated at that time. Then
> they vote--only once. If they vote more than once it's fraud. If they
> try to vote and have no registration, they are disallowed. What kind of
> fraud is it that imply leaves no evidence?
>
> Among the sciences, (all of which are no considered liberal plots),
> there is statistics. This particular science indicates there is no
> fraud. What reason would there be to write legislation to carefully
> overcome activity Whatthat is not happening? The converse argument
> against "not statistically significant" is--what?
>
> > At least where I live we have common sense. When
> > I go to the polling place, which is run by both
> > black and white people, male and female, I have to
> > show an ID (driver's licence in my case). My name
> > is checked against the list of registered voters, and
> > checked off. Then I vote. I would be laughed out of
> > the place if I said I shouldn't have to give an ID.
>
> But it doesn't have to be a picture ID.
>
> > Why do you not want a simple common-sense procedure
> > like that, unless you have Democrat fraud in mind?
>
> Why do you want to demand a "special" ID, if not to limit the vote to
> those who don't have them, more frequently poorer people and people of
> color which frequently don't have a driver's licence.
> --
> I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
> with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
> -- Galileo

I don't care whether it is a picture ID or not, but it
should be an ID that is not easily duplicatable, so that
any particular ID is used only once per election. Picture
IDs make the most sense because then the person is
connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
registration list. Anything else invites abuse.

Mack A. Damia · External Since: Aug 28, 2010 Posts: 180

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:50:13 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>On Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:52:50 PM UTC-4, gtr wrote:
>> On 2012-03-17 22:57:52 +0000, calvin said:
>>
>> > On Saturday, March 17, 2012 4:22:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> >> [quoting Wikipedia]
>> >> "Evidence of voter fraud was never substantiated on a large or
>> >> organized scale in states that enacted no voter ID laws. ?In 2007, a
>> >> report prepared by the staff of the federal Election Assistance
>> >> Commission found that, among experts, "there is widespread but not
>> >> unanimous agreement that there is little polling place fraud".[20] The
>> >> report was based on research conducted by a Republican elections
>> >> lawyer and another expert with liberal leanings."[20]
>> >> ...
>> >
>> > Of course there is no evidence. The whole point of
>> > allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence
>> > of the fraud.
>>
>> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.
>
>Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.
>
>> There is no
>> evidence of a bus in your driveway--there's no reason to write laws to
>> keep one out of your driveway.
>>
>> We have humans that register, they are validated at that time. Then
>> they vote--only once. If they vote more than once it's fraud. If they
>> try to vote and have no registration, they are disallowed. What kind of
>> fraud is it that imply leaves no evidence?
>>
>> Among the sciences, (all of which are no considered liberal plots),
>> there is statistics. This particular science indicates there is no
>> fraud. What reason would there be to write legislation to carefully
>> overcome activity Whatthat is not happening? The converse argument
>> against "not statistically significant" is--what?
>>
>> > At least where I live we have common sense. When
>> > I go to the polling place, which is run by both
>> > black and white people, male and female, I have to
>> > show an ID (driver's licence in my case). My name
>> > is checked against the list of registered voters, and
>> > checked off. Then I vote. I would be laughed out of
>> > the place if I said I shouldn't have to give an ID.
>>
>> But it doesn't have to be a picture ID.
>>
>> > Why do you not want a simple common-sense procedure
>> > like that, unless you have Democrat fraud in mind?
>>
>> Why do you want to demand a "special" ID, if not to limit the vote to
>> those who don't have them, more frequently poorer people and people of
>> color which frequently don't have a driver's licence.
>> --
>> I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
>> with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
>> -- Galileo
>
>I don't care whether it is a picture ID or not, but it
>should be an ID that is not easily duplicatable, so that
>any particular ID is used only once per election. Picture
>IDs make the most sense because then the person is
>connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
>registration list. Anything else invites abuse.

Hell, Calvin, why don't we just tattoo social security numbers? It
fits in with the rest of your jackbooted methods.
--

calvin · External Since: Feb 07, 2009 Posts: 505

On Saturday, March 17, 2012 9:57:11 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:50:13 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
> ... Picture
> >IDs make the most sense because then the person is
> >connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
> >registration list. Anything else invites abuse.
>
> Hell, Calvin, why don't we just tattoo social security numbers? It
> fits in with the rest of your jackbooted methods.

Yeah, one person one vote, a Nazi motto.

Howard Brazee · External Since: Sep 25, 2005 Posts: 1419

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 17:41:03 -0700, Mack A. Damia
wrote:

>The cards are on the table. The Republican drive to require photo ID
>has been revealed to be a ploy to disenfranchise millions of people.
>I'm not the one who started it; I'm only repeating what I've read from
>informed sources.

I expect it's more of a campaign thing, not designed to do anything
except satisfy their supporters.

>You deny common sense and logic. No pervasive evidence of voter fraud
>has ever been found, and the best you can come up with is, "The whole
>point of allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence of
>the fraud."

The right wing doesn't mind spending lots of money and creating more
bureaucracy to make sure the wrong people don't get treated fairly.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

Mack A. Damia · External Since: Aug 28, 2010 Posts: 180

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 19:26:29 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

>On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 17:41:03 -0700, Mack A. Damia
> wrote:
>
>>The cards are on the table. The Republican drive to require photo ID
>>has been revealed to be a ploy to disenfranchise millions of people.
>>I'm not the one who started it; I'm only repeating what I've read from
>>informed sources.
>
>I expect it's more of a campaign thing, not designed to do anything
>except satisfy their supporters.

I'm certain there's some truth to what you say, but to require photo
I-Ds to many who don't even have a birth certificate is tantamount to
a Jim Crow law.

>>You deny common sense and logic. No pervasive evidence of voter fraud
>>has ever been found, and the best you can come up with is, "The whole
>>point of allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence of
>>the fraud."
>
>The right wing doesn't mind spending lots of money and creating more
>bureaucracy to make sure the wrong people don't get treated fairly.

History must eventaully reveal that the Republican Party appealed to
the ignorant and the baser instincts of jungle mentality.
--

Mack A. Damia · External Since: Aug 28, 2010 Posts: 180

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 19:24:32 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>On Saturday, March 17, 2012 9:57:11 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:50:13 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
>> ... Picture
>> >IDs make the most sense because then the person is
>> >connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
>> >registration list. Anything else invites abuse.
>>
>> Hell, Calvin, why don't we just tattoo social security numbers? It
>> fits in with the rest of your jackbooted methods.
>
>Yeah, one person one vote, a Nazi motto.

More like "Der Endlösung".
--

calvin · External Since: Feb 07, 2009 Posts: 505

On Saturday, March 17, 2012 10:53:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 19:24:32 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
> >On Saturday, March 17, 2012 9:57:11 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> >> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:50:13 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
> >> ... Picture
> >> >IDs make the most sense because then the person is
> >> >connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
> >> >registration list. Anything else invites abuse.
> >>
> >> Hell, Calvin, why don't we just tattoo social security numbers? It
> >> fits in with the rest of your jackbooted methods.
> >
> >Yeah, one person one vote, a Nazi motto.
>
> More like "Der Endlösung".

Your final solution to a difference of opinion is
to call the other person a Nazi.

gtr · External Since: Feb 17, 2010 Posts: 155

On 2012-03-18 01:50:13 +0000, calvin said:

> On Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:52:50 PM UTC-4, gtr wrote:
>> On 2012-03-17 22:57:52 +0000, calvin said:
>>
>>> On Saturday, March 17, 2012 4:22:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>>>> [quoting Wikipedia]
>>>> "Evidence of voter fraud was never substantiated on a large or
>>>> organized scale in states that enacted no voter ID laws. ?In 2007, a
>>>> report prepared by the staff of the federal Election Assistance
>>>> Commission found that, among experts, "there is widespread but not
>>>> unanimous agreement that there is little polling place fraud".[20] The
>>>> report was based on research conducted by a Republican elections
>>>> lawyer and another expert with liberal leanings."[20]
>>>> ...
>>>
>>> Of course there is no evidence. The whole point of
>>> allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence
>>> of the fraud.
>>
>> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.
>
> Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.

If there's fraud CITE IT! If you can't cite the fraud there is none.
No logic could be more elementary.
--
I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
-- Galileo

Mack A. Damia · External Since: Aug 28, 2010 Posts: 180

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 20:55:47 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>On Saturday, March 17, 2012 10:53:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 19:24:32 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
>> >On Saturday, March 17, 2012 9:57:11 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:50:13 -0700 (PDT), calvin wrote:
>> >> ... Picture
>> >> >IDs make the most sense because then the person is
>> >> >connected to the ID and the ID is connected to the voter
>> >> >registration list. Anything else invites abuse.
>> >>
>> >> Hell, Calvin, why don't we just tattoo social security numbers? It
>> >> fits in with the rest of your jackbooted methods.
>> >
>> >Yeah, one person one vote, a Nazi motto.
>>
>> More like "Der Endlösung".
>
>Your final solution to a difference of opinion is
>to call the other person a Nazi.

When it comes to today's Republicans, if the boot fits......

I've watched you on the genuine news; I've heard your lies and
propaganda. I've seen your methods.
--

--

calvin · External Since: Feb 07, 2009 Posts: 505

On Sunday, March 18, 2012 12:39:29 AM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> ...
> I've watched you on the genuine news; I've heard your lies and
> propaganda. I've seen your methods.

I guess there's no defense I can make against
your indictment, prosecution, and judgement.
At least you didn't associate me with the real
threat to the world.

Auf Wiedersehen.

gtr · External Since: Feb 17, 2010 Posts: 155

On 2012-03-18 04:34:16 +0000, gtr said:

>>> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.
>>
>> Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.
>
> If there's fraud CITE IT! If you can't cite the fraud there is none.
> No logic could be more elementary.

Still waiting for you to clarify the elementary logic that a lack of
evidence is a form of proof.

Explain it or admit your a Republican shill. Either will do.
--
I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
-- Galileo

Mack A. Damia · External Since: Aug 28, 2010 Posts: 180

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 23:31:05 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>Auf Wiedersehen

Practice saying that to Obermormonfuhrer Romney in November.
--

Tom · External Since: Feb 03, 2009 Posts: 259

On Mar 17, 11:34 pm, gtr wrote:
> On 2012-03-18 01:50:13 +0000, calvin said:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:52:50 PM UTC-4, gtr wrote:
> >> On 2012-03-17 22:57:52 +0000, calvin said:
>
> >>> On Saturday, March 17, 2012 4:22:48 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> >>>> [quoting Wikipedia]
> >>>> "Evidence of voter fraud was never substantiated on a large or
> >>>> organized scale in states that enacted no voter ID laws. ?In 2007, a
> >>>> report prepared by the staff of the federal Election Assistance
> >>>> Commission found that, among experts, "there is widespread but not
> >>>> unanimous agreement that there is little polling place fraud".[20] The
> >>>> report was based on research conducted by a Republican elections
> >>>> lawyer and another expert with liberal leanings."[20]
> >>>> ...
>
> >>> Of course there is no evidence. The whole point of
> >>> allowing voting without ID is that there is no evidence
> >>> of the fraud.
>
> >> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.
>
> > Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.
>
> If there's fraud CITE IT! If you can't cite the fraud there is none.
> No logic could be more elementary.
> --
> I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
> with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
> -- Galileo

I read an article recently about vote fraud in Ohio in the last
national election. I don't recall the actual percentage, but there
were a lot of zeroes to the right of the decimal point. It looked
something like this... 0.0000000000000009%

In terms of the actual number fraudulent ballots cast, it was four
votes in the over 9 million cast in Ohio in that election.

Tom

Howard Brazee · External Since: Sep 25, 2005 Posts: 1419

On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 18:53:52 -0700 (PDT), calvin
wrote:

>On Saturday, March 17, 2012 9:26:29 PM UTC-4, Howard Brazee wrote:
>> ...
>> The right wing doesn't mind spending lots of money and creating more
>> bureaucracy to make sure the wrong people don't get treated fairly.
>
>Keep telling yourself that and you will always feel
>good, lying on your bed of lies.

I don't feel good.

The current programs to drug test people wanting aid are much more
expensive than giving them the aid. It's not about the money.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

gtr · External Since: Feb 17, 2010 Posts: 155

On 2012-03-18 14:09:25 +0000, Tom said:

>>>> There is no evidence of fraud--meaning there is no fraud.
>>
>>> Wrong. You need to learn a little elementary logic.
>>
>> If there's fraud CITE IT! If you can't cite the fraud there is none.
>> No logic could be more elementary.
>
> I read an article recently about vote fraud in Ohio in the last
> national election. I don't recall the actual percentage, but there
> were a lot of zeroes to the right of the decimal point. It looked
> something like this... 0.0000000000000009%

I haven't done the computation but I heard last week that over a decade
in Texas, an estimated 800 million votes evidenced 50 cases of
illegalities. In another state set of stats it was found that almost
all the fraud was unintentional, and that NONE of the fraud would have
been caught by voter ID.

That is, it was predominantly multiple enrollment in absentee voting
when someone moved but not out of their previous district, or changed
districts but accidentally mailed their old absentee ballot in.

> In terms of the actual number fraudulent ballots cast, it was four
> votes in the over 9 million cast in Ohio in that election.
--
I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us
with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.
-- Galileo