Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandrake

alt.os.linux.mandrake Sta · External Since: Jul 29, 2005 Posts: 94

============================================================================
Analysis of posts to alt.os.linux.mandrake by Robert Marshall
============================================================================
(stats compiled with a script by Garry Knight)

Total posts considered: 7 over 7 days
Earliest article: Fri May 11 21:25:07 2007
Latest article: Fri May 18 11:25:04 2007
Original articles: 4, replies: 3
Total size of posts: 33,217 bytes (32K) (0.03M)
Average 1 articles per day, 0.00 MB per day, 4,745 bytes per article
Total headers: 6 KB bodies: 25 KB
Body text - quoted: 0 KB, original: 24 KB = 96.76%, sigs: 0 KB
Total number of posters: 6, average 5,536 bytes per poster
Total number of threads: 5, average 6,643 bytes per thread
Total number of User-Agents: 25

============================================================================
Top 6 posters by number of articles
============================================================================
1: Gordon <flash130 DeleteThis @yahoo.com>.................................... : 2
2: alt.os.linux.mandriva Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 1
3: alt.os.linux.mandrake Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 1
4: "news.freedom2surf.net" <iedmont DeleteThis @googlemail.com>............... : 1
5: Tim Long <mr.tim.long DeleteThis @gmail.com>............................... : 1
6: foo <foo@foo>.................................................. : 1

============================================================================
Top 6 posters by article size in Kbytes
============================================================================
1: alt.os.linux.mandriva Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 15
2: alt.os.linux.mandrake Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 9
3: Gordon <flash130 DeleteThis @yahoo.com>.................................... : 2
4: Tim Long <mr.tim.long DeleteThis @gmail.com>............................... : 2
5: "news.freedom2surf.net" <iedmont DeleteThis @googlemail.com>............... : 1
6: foo <foo@foo>.................................................. : 1

============================================================================
Top -1 responders by original text (> 5 posts)
============================================================================

============================================================================
Bottom -1 responders by original text (> 5 posts)
============================================================================

============================================================================
Top 5 threads by no. of articles
============================================================================
1: Mandriva One 2007.1 Boot CD.................................... : 2
2: unable to read superblock...................................... : 2
3: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandrake........................... : 1
4: Shorewall Accounting........................................... : 1
5: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandriva........................... : 1

============================================================================
Top 5 threads by size in KB
============================================================================
1: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandriva........................... : 15
2: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandrake........................... : 9
3: Mandriva One 2007.1 Boot CD.................................... : 3
4: unable to read superblock...................................... : 2
5: Shorewall Accounting........................................... : 2

============================================================================
Top 1 cross-posted groups
============================================================================
1: alt.os.linux.mandriva.......................................... : 4

============================================================================
Top 10 User Agents by poster
============================================================================
1: Unknown........................................................ : 2
2: Pan............................................................ : 1
3: G2............................................................. : 1
4: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (X11....................................... : 1
5: Outlook Express................................................ : 1
6: Gnus........................................................... : 0
7: News Rover..................................................... : 0
8: MacSOUP........................................................ : 0
9: WebTV.......................................................... : 0
10: Foorum......................................................... : 0

============================================================================
Top 5 User Agents by number of posts
============================================================================
1: unknown................................................... : 2 (29%)
2: Pan....................................................... : 2 (29%)
3: G2........................................................ : 1 (14%)
4: Outlook Express........................................... : 1 (14%)
5: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (X11.................................. : 1 (14%)

============================================================================
Top 10 time zones
============================================================================
1: UTC............................................................ : 4
2: +1000.......................................................... : 1
3: +0100.......................................................... : 1
4: -0700.......................................................... : 1

============================================================================
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This was auto-posted using a script by Garry Knight.
Please send questions or comments to usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Robert Marshall · External Since: Jul 30, 2004 Posts: 95

On Fri, 18 May 2007, alt os.linux mandrake Stats wrote:

> ============================================================================
> Analysis of posts to alt.os.linux.mandrake by Robert Marshall
> ============================================================================
> (stats compiled with a script by Garry Knight)
>
>
> Total posts considered: 7 over 7 days
> ============================================================================
> Top 6 posters by number of articles
> ============================================================================
> 1: Gordon <flash130 DeleteThis @yahoo.com>.................................... : 2
> 2: alt.os.linux.mandriva Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 1
> 3: alt.os.linux.mandrake Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 1

So one poster was more active than the weekly stats (posted by me)

>
> ============================================================================
> Top 6 posters by article size in Kbytes
> ============================================================================
> 1: alt.os.linux.mandriva Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 15
> 2: alt.os.linux.mandrake Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>............ : 9

Well I suppose they're long postings

> ============================================================================
> Top 10 User Agents by poster
> ============================================================================
> 1: Unknown........................................................ : 2

Me again!

Nearly time for turning the lights out on a.o.l.mandrake... ?

Robert
--
La grenouille songe..dans son château d'eau
Links and things http://rmstar.blogspot.com/

David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Sun, 20 May 2007 10:49:03 -0400, Whiskers <catwheezel.TakeThisOut@operamail.com> wrote:

> Looks as though it's becoming as dormant as any alt group can be.

It's a lot harder to get rid of a newsgroup, than it is to create one.

alt.os.linux.mandriva still has some propagation problems, and poorly
(or completely) unsupported isp servers (especially outsourced ones),
that still haven't added it.

While mci (aka uunet) have added the group, anything posted via there
server never seems to propagate to other servers. Good luck trying
to find anyone at mci, to even discuss the problem with.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

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Moe Trin · External Since: Aug 12, 2004 Posts: 1732

On Sun, 20 May 2007, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mandrake, in article
<op.tsms0eeba3w0dx RemoveThis @hodgins.homeip.net>, David W. Hodgins wrote:

>Whiskers <catwheezel RemoveThis @operamail.com> wrote:

>> Looks as though it's becoming as dormant as any alt group can be.
>
>It's a lot harder to get rid of a newsgroup, than it is to create one.

Yes - the only thing you can do is to unsubscribe to the group. After
a few years, the news admin may notice the lack of activity.

>While mci (aka uunet) have added the group, anything posted via there
>server never seems to propagate to other servers. Good luck trying
>to find anyone at mci, to even discuss the problem with.

[compton ~]$ du -sk /var/spool/news
24525 /var/spool/news
[compton ~]$ wc .active.groups
84 .active.groups
[compton ~]$ find /var/spool/news/news/ -type f -name [0-9]\* -print |
wc -l
7630
[compton ~]$

Of those articles, I see 14 articles with the string 'uu.net' in the
Path: header and all of them seem to be in Europe - several bangs away
from the server I'm using. There are no articles with 'mci' in the
Path: header. I don't know why. At one time, a lot of people were
angry with mci/uu.net and may dropped peering agreements, but that
would be a wild guess. Dumb question, what kind of activity are
you seeing in the Big Eight groups that news servers are supposed to
be carrying?

[compton ~]$ zgrep linux big.8.list.05.15.07.gz | cut -f1 | column
comp.os.linux.advocacy comp.os.linux.misc
comp.os.linux.alpha comp.os.linux.networking
comp.os.linux.announce comp.os.linux.portable
comp.os.linux.answers comp.os.linux.powerpc
comp.os.linux.development.apps comp.os.linux.security
comp.os.linux.development.system comp.os.linux.setup
comp.os.linux.embedded comp.os.linux.x
comp.os.linux.hardware comp.os.linux.xbox
comp.os.linux.m68k
[compton ~]$ grep ^05 newslog | grep comp.os.linux.misc | grep killed |
cut -d' ' -f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print
total }'
1371
[compton ~]$ ^misc^networking
grep ^05 newslog | grep comp.os.linux.networking | grep killed | cut -d' '
-f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
267
[compton ~]$ ^comp.os.linux.networking^alt.os.linux.mandrake
grep ^05 newslog | grep alt.os.linux.mandrake | grep killed | cut -d' '
-f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
63
[compton ~]$ ^drake^driva
grep ^05 newslog | grep alt.os.linux.mandriva | grep killed | cut -d' '
-f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
641
[compton ~]$

That's 1371 articles so far this month in c.o.l.misc, and 267 in
c.o.l.networking, verses 63 in a.o.l.mandrake verses 641 in the
a.o.l.manrdiva group. By the way, I subscribe to several other
alt.* groups that are lucky to see ten articles a month - some even
less than that.

In theory, you could ask the sales-droid why you aren't getting what
you are paying for - yes, I said "in theory".

Old guy

David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Mon, 21 May 2007 20:32:15 -0400, Moe Trin <ibuprofin RemoveThis @painkiller.example.tld> wrote:

> [compton ~]$ zgrep linux big.8.list.05.15.07.gz | cut -f1 | column
> comp.os.linux.advocacy comp.os.linux.misc
> comp.os.linux.alpha comp.os.linux.networking
> comp.os.linux.announce comp.os.linux.portable
> comp.os.linux.answers comp.os.linux.powerpc
> comp.os.linux.development.apps comp.os.linux.security
> comp.os.linux.development.system comp.os.linux.setup
> comp.os.linux.embedded comp.os.linux.x
> comp.os.linux.hardware comp.os.linux.xbox
> comp.os.linux.m68k

They carry the above plus comp.os.linux.help

As leafnode merges the input from both of the news servers, (it skips
any messages already downloaded from motzeralla, which I check first),
I just fired up pan, and subscribed to the four newsgroups directly
from mci (via nnrp.ca.mci.com). I've downloaded the headers from (and
including) May 1st, to roughly 2200 edt, today.

> [compton ~]$ grep ^05 newslog | grep comp.os.linux.misc | grep killed |
> cut -d' ' -f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print
> total }'
> 1371

591 headers.

> [compton ~]$ ^misc^networking
> grep ^05 newslog | grep comp.os.linux.networking | grep killed | cut -d' '
> -f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
> 267

113

> [compton ~]$ ^comp.os.linux.networking^alt.os.linux.mandrake
> grep ^05 newslog | grep alt.os.linux.mandrake | grep killed | cut -d' '
> -f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
> 63

16

> [compton ~]$ ^drake^driva
> grep ^05 newslog | grep alt.os.linux.mandriva | grep killed | cut -d' '
> -f4 | awk 'BEGIN { FS="/" } ; { total +=$1 } ; END { print total }'
> 641

5

> That's 1371 articles so far this month in c.o.l.misc, and 267 in
> c.o.l.networking, verses 63 in a.o.l.mandrake verses 641 in the
> a.o.l.manrdiva group. By the way, I subscribe to several other
> alt.* groups that are lucky to see ten articles a month - some even
> less than that.

Checking on google groups, I find almost no uunet paths, in any of
the alt groups.

> In theory, you could ask the sales-droid why you aren't getting what
> you are paying for - yes, I said "in theory".

As I'm a customer of a customer (my isp, ody.ca) uunet wouldn't even
respond to me. When relaying through the owner of the isp, their response
was that my postings were showing up fine, as far as they were concerned..
They completely ignored the fact, that I was complaining about my articles
failing to propagate to other news servers, not about a failure for the
articles to post to their news server.

The owner of my isp was as helpfull, as he could be, but given uunet/mci's
reputation, I actually prefer not to identified as a customer of any of
their services. Although they are my isp's upstream (under the name
alter.net), at least the isp has his own ip space, not just a swip
from mci.

I strongly suspect the problem is due to mci's historic spam support.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

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David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Mon, 21 May 2007 22:16:51 -0400, David W. Hodgins <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

I just responded to this thread via mci. See if the appended message
ever shows up at other news servers ...

Path: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca!nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
From: "David W. Hodgins" <davidwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Subject: Re: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandrake
Newsgroups: alt.os.linux.mandrake
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001.TakeThisOut@faure.chezmarshall.freeserve..co.uk>
<m1hcq7ejfb.fsf.TakeThisOut@chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
<20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE.TakeThisOut@ID-107770.user.individual.net>
User-Agent: Pan/0.128 (SR/CL: Leitmotiv: Toynbee Idea)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <UIs4i.10149$13.4522@nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca>
Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 02:38:44 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.240.2.104
X-Complaints-To: abuse.TakeThisOut@ca.mci.com
X-Trace: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca 1179801524 216.240.2.104 (Mon, 21 May 2007 22:38:44 EDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 22:38:44 EDT
Organization: MCI Canada News Reader Service
Xref: news.ca.mci.com alt.os.linux.mandrake:593221
X-Received-Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 22:38:44 EDT (nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca)

On Sun, 20 May 2007 15:49:03 +0100, Whiskers wrote:

> [quoted text muted]

Especially on uunet.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

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Moe Trin · External Since: Aug 12, 2004 Posts: 1732

On Mon, 21 May 2007, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mandrake, in article
<op.tspi6jnoa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>, David W. Hodgins wrote:

>I just responded to this thread via mci. See if the appended message
>ever shows up at other news servers ...

>Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 02:38:44 GMT
>NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.240.2.104
>X-Complaints-To: abuse DeleteThis @ca.mci.com
>X-Trace: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca 1179801524 216.240.2.104 (Mon,
21 May 2007 22:38:44 EDT)

1 D 9:Jay Carpenter] video editing
2 D 72:[Moe Trin ] Re: Statistics for alt.os.linux.mandrake
3 D 96:[David W. Hod] ->
-> D 47:[David W. Hod] ->
5 - 97:[Moe Trin ] ->

[compton ~]$ grep 05/22 ../newslog | grep mandrake
05/22/2007 06:02:06 Fetching articles for alt.os.linux.mandrake.
05/22/2007 06:02:07 alt.os.linux.mandrake: Retrieving articles 668340-668344.
05/22/2007 06:02:07 alt.os.linux.mandrake: 5 articles available.
05/22/2007 06:02:10 alt.os.linux.mandrake: 5/5 (0 killed), Time: 00:02:01
[compton ~]$

Never showed up here. Article "2" above is timed at 21 May 2007 19:32:15
-0500, and is the one article "3" is responding to at 22:16:51 -0400.

Old guy

David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Tue, 22 May 2007 15:53:35 -0400, Moe Trin <ibuprofin DeleteThis @painkiller.example.tld> wrote:

> Never showed up here. Article "2" above is timed at 21 May 2007 19:32:15
> -0500, and is the one article "3" is responding to at 22:16:51 -0400.

Currently, there are 6 messages for the subject Statistics (From May 1st on).

From: alt.os.linux.mandriva Stats <usenet DeleteThis @capuchin.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 21:15:04 +0100
Message-ID: <uSluGEd4zeluU67eYBl16QNp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>

From: "David W. Hodgins" <davidwhodgins DeleteThis @nomail.afraid.org>
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
<m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
<20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net>
Message-ID: <UIs4i.10149$13.4522@nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca>

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins DeleteThis @nomail.afraid.org>
Message-ID: <op.tspi6jnoa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net> <op.tsms0eeba3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <slrnf54eg5.8v2.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us> <op.tsphydywa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>

From: ibuprofin DeleteThis @painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net> <op.tsms0eeba3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <slrnf54eg5.8v2.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us> <op.tsphydywa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>
Message-Id: <slrnf54qmb.b2q.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us>

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins DeleteThis @nomail.afraid.org>
Message-ID: <op.tsqhf0aua3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net> <op.tsms0eeba3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <slrnf54eg5.8v2.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us> <op.tsphydywa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <slrnf54qmb.b2q.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us>

From: ibuprofin DeleteThis @painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
References: <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001 DeleteThis @faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk> <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net> <op.tsms0eeba3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <slrnf54eg5.8v2.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us> <op.tsphydywa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net> <op.tspi6jnoa3w0dx DeleteThis @hodgins.homeip.net>
Message-Id: <slrnf56iht.nmm.ibuprofin DeleteThis @compton.phx.az.us>

So it looks like they are getting messages posted at motzeralla.org, but
never sending messages out.

The path on your message ...
Path: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca!newsfeed.east.grouptelecom.net!wesley.videotron.net!newsfeed.nyu.edu!newsfeed.telusplanet.net!newsfeed.telus.net!hwmnpeer01.phx!news.highwinds-media.com!newsfeed.news2me.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.sedona.net!news.sedona.net.POSTED!not-for-mail

Shows they are getting some messages, from other servers. The count shows they
are missing a lot, and messages posted at uunet, never seem to go anywhere, at
least for the alt groups.

The two posts showing from Wiskers, and Robert Marshall, on May 20th, have not
shown up.

Their paths are, when received on motzarella.org, are ...

Path: news.motzarella.org!newsfeed.kamp.net!newsfeed.kamp.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!
individual.net!not-for-mail
Message-ID: <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE DeleteThis @ID-107770.user.individual.net>
From: Whiskers <catwheezel DeleteThis @operamail.com>

Path: news.motzarella.org!newsfeed0.kamp.net!newsfeed.kamp.net!news.unit0.net!
newsfeed.freenet.de!news2.euro.net!news-in.ntli.net!newsrout1-win.ntli.net!ntli.net!
news.highwinds-media.com!newspeer1-win.ntli.net!newsfe4-gui.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!
not-for-mail
Message-ID: <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
From: Robert Marshall <spam DeleteThis @chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>

None of the uunet.* groups, such as uunet.tech, uunet.status, uunet.forum, etc. have
any headers, at all.

I've posted a message to uunet.forum (uunet.tech, doesnt allow posting). I'll see
if anyone responds, at all.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

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Moe Trin · External Since: Aug 12, 2004 Posts: 1732

On Tue, 22 May 2007, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mandrake, in article
<op.tsq0nt1ja3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>, David W. Hodgins wrote:

>Currently, there are 6 messages for the subject Statistics (From May
>1st on).

There's a dozen here:

From: alt.os.linux.mandrake Stats <usenet.TakeThisOut@capuchin.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 21:00:02 +0100
Message-ID:
<KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001.TakeThisOut@faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>

From: Robert Marshall <spam.TakeThisOut@chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
Message-ID: <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf.TakeThisOut@chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 13:11:32 GMT

From: Whiskers <catwheezel.TakeThisOut@operamail.com>
Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 15:49:03 +0100
Message-ID: <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE.TakeThisOut@ID-107770.user.individual.net>

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 11:22:52 -0400
Message-ID: <op.tsms0eeba3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>

From: ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
Message-Id: <slrnf54eg5.8v2.ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@compton.phx.az.us>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 19:32:15 -0500

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 22:16:51 -0400
Message-ID: <op.tsphydywa3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 22:43:21 -0400
Message-ID: <op.tspi6jnoa3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>

From: ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
Message-Id: <slrnf54qmb.b2q.ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@compton.phx.az.us>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 23:00:22 -0500

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 11:03:26 -0400
Message-ID: <op.tsqhf0aua3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>

From: ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
Message-Id: <slrnf56iht.nmm.ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@compton.phx.az.us>
Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 14:53:35 -0500

From: ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld (Moe Trin)
Message-Id: <slrnf56j0k.nmm.ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@compton.phx.az.us>
Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 15:01:28 -0500

From: "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 17:58:31 -0400
Message-ID: <op.tsq0nt1ja3w0dx.TakeThisOut@hodgins.homeip.net>

>From: "David W. Hodgins" <davidwhodgins.TakeThisOut@nomail.afraid.org>
>References:
> <KoSh62X4wjEYNTCAUxpSQaAp-00001.TakeThisOut@faure.chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
> <m1hcq7ejfb.fsf.TakeThisOut@chezmarshall.freeserve.co.uk>
> <20070520144903.391B.7.NOFFLE.TakeThisOut@ID-107770.user.individual.net>

The references header is created by your newsreader, based on the
existing "References:" header in the article you are replying to. It
has virtually nothing to do with your news server.

>So it looks like they are getting messages posted at motzeralla.org, but
>never sending messages out.

or someone is dropping the ball - but yeah.

>The path on your message ...
>Path: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca
!newsfeed.east.grouptelecom.net!wesley.videotron.net!newsfeed.nyu.edu
!newsfeed.telusplanet.net!newsfeed.telus.net!hwmnpeer01.phx
!news.highwinds-media.com!newsfeed.news2me.com
!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH
!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com
!local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com !nntp.sedona.net!news.sedona.net.POSTED
!not-for-mail

Holy freaken' Toledo! That's [counts bangs in path] twenty hops!. You
might try using " head /path/to/spool/* | grep ^Path: | cut -d'!' -f5 "
to see if they are peering with anyone besides 'grouptelecom.net'

>The two posts showing from Wiskers, and Robert Marshall, on May 20th,
>have not shown up.

and probably aren't going to - the worst propagation delay I recall
seeing is like two days, and that was back when spooling was done over
a dial-up using UUCP. Either mci.com or uunet.ca have filters
dropping a lot of posts, or nobody wants to peer with them, and they
are getting crumbs. This _could_ also have something to do with
grouptelecom.net or videotron.net which is peering with a medium sized
private university (NYU != SUNY) in New York City.

>Their paths are, when received on motzarella.org, are ...

going to be totally different. The "Path:" header lists the path that
the message took to reach "this" server. (RFC0977 refers to RFC0850
which was replaced by RFC1036 - see section 2.1.6 in that document).

>None of the uunet.* groups, such as uunet.tech, uunet.status,
>uunet.forum, etc. have any headers, at all.

giganews claims to carry those groups. supernews does not.

>I've posted a message to uunet.forum (uunet.tech, doesnt allow posting).
>I'll see if anyone responds, at all.

'uunet.forum' had 31 articles - yours being the "695th" in the local
numbering scheme. Lots of spam, but grabbing an article at random, I
found "Dead Forums" is article number 665 and is dated 16 Feb 2004.
Real active group you got there. Wink

I'll attempt to reply to your
post. The "Path:" header on your post read:

Path: border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com
!news-in-01.newsfeed.easynews.com!easynews.com!easynews!news.alt.net
!newsfeed.east.grouptelecom.net!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca
!nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail

so that looks as if grouptelecom.net also peers with news.alt.net
who-ever they are. 'easynews.com' I at least recognize.

Old guy

David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Wed, 23 May 2007 16:05:53 -0400, Moe Trin <ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld> wrote:

>> I've posted a message to uunet.forum (uunet.tech, doesnt allow posting).
>> I'll see if anyone responds, at all.
>
> 'uunet.forum' had 31 articles - yours being the "695th" in the local
> numbering scheme. Lots of spam, but grabbing an article at random, I
> found "Dead Forums" is article number 665 and is dated 16 Feb 2004.
> Real active group you got there. Wink

I'll attempt to reply to your
> post. The "Path:" header on your post read:

Your article got through. The path on it also shows grouptelecom.

Path: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca!newsfeed.east.grouptelecom.net!wesley.videotron.net!news-rly-1.sprintlink.net!news-peer1.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.yul.equant.net!opentransit.net!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.sedona.net!news.sedona.net.POSTED!not-for-mail

I thinks I'll stick with mozteralla, or other free servers for now.
If/when there are no free servers available, I go with one of the
block accounts, as I only use text groups anyway.

Thanks for the help confirming uunet is useless for usenet.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

--
Change nomail.afraid.org to ody.ca to reply by email.
(nomail.afraid.org has been set up specifically for
use in usenet. Feel free to use it yourself.)

Moe Trin · External Since: Aug 12, 2004 Posts: 1732

On Thu, 24 May 2007, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mandrake, in article
<op.tstvbgfaa3w0dx.DeleteThis@hodgins.homeip.net>, David W. Hodgins wrote:

>Moe Trin <ibuprofin.DeleteThis@painkiller.example.tld> wrote:

>> I'll attempt to reply to your post. The "Path:" header on your post
>> read:
>
>Your article got through. The path on it also shows grouptelecom.
>
>Path: nnrp.ca.mci.com!nnrp1.uunet.ca!news.ca.mci.com!news.uunet.ca
!newsfeed.east.grouptelecom.net!wesley.videotron.net
!news-rly-1.sprintlink.net!news-peer1.sprintlink.net
!newsfeed.yul.equant.net!opentransit.net!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com
!nntp.giganews.com!local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.sedona.net
!news.sedona.net.POSTED!not-for-mail

Hey, that's only sixteen hops Wink

(This post I'm responding to
says motzarella.org is only seven hops away.)

A couple of years ago, I was troubleshooting a news problem at a
relatively clueless ISP (their operation consisted of less than a dozen
PCs, mainly running NT4 - shows how clueless they were). One of the
things I checked was the news server peering. Basically, I just grep'ed
for the Path: header, and then printed out the last couple of hops
using

grep ^Path: /path/to/news.spool | cut -d'!' -f1-n

where that last 'n' was 3 to perhaps 6 or seven, and passing this
output to 'sort | uniq -c' to see what peers were where. I just ran a
quickie check here, and both giganews and supernews seem to each have
over 25 peers. Based on what you've shown, it seems as if mci.com or
uunet.ca has _one_ peer (grouptelecom.net), while that peer has a
limited number of other peers, one of which is videotron.net (who seems
to have a slightly larger number of peers based on very limited
evidence). Bottom line - mci.com/uunet.ca is not in the news business.

>I thinks I'll stick with mozteralla, or other free servers for now.
>If/when there are no free servers available, I go with one of the
>block accounts, as I only use text groups anyway.

There obviously are a number of decent low cost providers available.
I tend to be a bit nervous about the totally free providers, as
the cost of running a news server isn't spare change. Decent retention
requires a lot of disk space (no idea what now, but seven years ago,
supernews was advertising having over 300 Gigabytes, so it's probably
into the terabytes now) and the bandwidth isn't cheap. Having even a
single person available 24/7 costs a couple of coins too. The other
problem I've seen with free providers (google is a perfect example) is
a lack of abuse oversight - shades of uunet.

>Thanks for the help confirming uunet is useless for usenet.

Spend some time reading the 'news.admin.net-abuse.* groups, and you
are likely to find out they are considered useless for a few other
things as well.

Old guy

David W. Hodgins · External Since: Dec 04, 2005 Posts: 277

On Thu, 24 May 2007 20:51:47 -0400, Moe Trin <ibuprofin.TakeThisOut@painkiller.example.tld> wrote:

> Spend some time reading the 'news.admin.net-abuse.* groups, and you
> are likely to find out they are considered useless for a few other
> things as well.

The oldest posting of mine currently shown by google is from 2003
http://groups.google.ca/group/news.admin.net-abuse.email/msg/5f030b8413682609?

I don't post there very much, but have been lurking for a long time. I'm
very familiar with the problem with uunet/mci/whatever name they're using today.

Looks like google has lost a lot of old messages. Just ran a search on my
first internet email address, dave.hodgins.TakeThisOut@canrem.com Google groups doesn't
show any, while a google web search still finds two archives, with articles
I posted.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

--
Change nomail.afraid.org to ody.ca to reply by email.
(nomail.afraid.org has been set up specifically for
use in usenet. Feel free to use it yourself.)

freemont · External Since: Jun 06, 2007 Posts: 2

On Wed, 06 Jun 2007 21:40:46 +1200, Adam writ:

> Well - suddenly (a shorttime ago) the whole list of
> messages and followups on this NG has disappeared
> from my view. All that is left is;
>
> 5 on Statistics
> unable to read superblock (interesting)
> 2 on Re: MAndriva 2006
> how to remove softlink ..
> Inventor of ctrl-Alt-Del ..
> Solved ..
>
> 11 in total.
>
> So what's happened here ? Have the older messages
> just 'timed out' - or has some kind of washing occurred ?

Everything prior to the 22nd, eh? Wink

I have Pan set to expire articles older than two weeks. Sounds like you
have Knode set the same.

--
"Because all you of Earth are idiots!"
¯`·..·¯`·-> freemont© <-·¯`·..·¯

Adam · External Since: Jan 16, 2005 Posts: 99

Well - suddenly (a shorttime ago) the whole list of
messages and followups on this NG has disappeared
from my view. All that is left is;

5 on Statistics
unable to read superblock (interesting)
2 on Re: MAndriva 2006
how to remove softlink ..
Inventor of ctrl-Alt-Del ..
Solved ..

11 in total.

So what's happened here ? Have the older messages
just 'timed out' - or has some kind of washing occurred ?

Best to you regulars, anyway. Adam.

Adam · External Since: Jan 16, 2005 Posts: 99

> Everything prior to the 22nd, eh? Wink

>
> I have Pan set to expire articles older than two weeks. Sounds like you
> have Knode set the same.

OK. So no conspiracy then. Just many content Mandriva users!

Dan C · External Since: Nov 26, 2006 Posts: 657

On Wed, 06 Jun 2007 23:19:45 +1200, Adam wrote:

>> I have Pan set to expire articles older than two weeks. Sounds like you
>> have Knode set the same.

> OK. So no conspiracy then. Just many content Mandriva users!

Well, this *is* the old and outdated *mandrake* newsgroup. Since the name
change, most of the activity is in the *mandriva* newsgroup, and this one
is just kinda hanging around for stragglers. Eventually it will probably
go away.

--
"Ubuntu" -- an African word, meaning "Slackware is too hard for me".

Robert M. Riches Jr. · External Since: Apr 19, 2004 Posts: 1289

On 2007-06-06, Adam <nospam.DeleteThis@example.com> wrote:
>
>> Everything prior to the 22nd, eh? Wink

>>
>> I have Pan set to expire articles older than two weeks. Sounds like you
>> have Knode set the same.
>
>
> OK. So no conspiracy then. Just many content Mandriva users!

Don't you mean Mandrake users? 1/2 Smile

--
Robert Riches
spamtrap42.DeleteThis@verizon.net
(Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)

Adam · External Since: Jan 16, 2005 Posts: 99

Moe Trin wrote:

[as above] [snip].

Very interesting reply - many thanks.

It also raises the issue of alternate newsreaders.

Will take me some time to chew through, which I'll
enjoy doing. Thanks once again.

Moe Trin · External Since: Aug 12, 2004 Posts: 1732

On Thu, 07 Jun 2007, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mandrake, in article
<f47flu$pn8$1@lust.ihug.co.nz>, Adam wrote:

>Very interesting reply - many thanks.

You're welcome

>It also raises the issue of alternate newsreaders.

I use several news readers - and have to be aware that they are reading
from different configuration/data files. The older ones tend to use a
..newsrc file, but some (like slrn that I'm using here) use .jnewsrc.
And just to frustrate me slightly more, the files are in different
formats. At one time, I created a script to compare the files of the
different readers, and update the one I use least to the article
numbers of my normal reader. Now, I usually just manually enter the
data, as I use the other readers much less often.

In your post of 11:34:19 +1200, you write:

>And no Mandriva group can be seen on my
>refreshed newsgroup list. Hmmm.

On the 15th of each month, there is a posting to the newsgroups
news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, and news.lists.misc with a subject
of "List of Big Eight Newsgroups". This lists the 2280 "sanctioned"
news groups in the "big eight" hierarchy (comp.*, humanities.*, misc.*,
news.*, rec.*, sci.*, soc.*, and talk.*) with descriptions. Many servers
carry additional groups (often called "bogus" groups) in those eight
hierarchies - giganews has 4634. BEYOND that, there are dozens of
other hierarchies, such as 'alt.*' that are carried at the whim of the
news admin. Sometimes, this is a Dick-Size-War, with some servers
claiming to carry more news groups than any one else. Generally, this
means more _useless_ groups than any one else. As of this morning,
the server I'm reading from _lists_ 107113 groups, though how many are
active is anyone's guess. You can _ask_ your news admin to carry the
group. If it helps, I'm showing the following totals:

2H04 1H05 2H05 1H06 2H06 1H07
a.o.l.mandrake 25698 27063 16388 7516 5067 1259
a.o.l.mandriva 3181 7579 8254 5287

That's up to 15:00 UTC on 6 June 2007.

>I'll have a go at having that corrected, updated, included, when
>time permits.

These totals may help - giganews started carrying the group about a
month after it was created.

Old guy

Adam · External Since: Jan 16, 2005 Posts: 99

And no Mandriva group can be seen on my
refreshed newsgroup list. Hmmm.

I'll have a go at having that corrected, updated,
included, when time permits.