Seeding apt

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
there already?

I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Geoffrey Clements · External Since: Apr 06, 2004 Posts: 226

"Tony Houghton" <h.TakeThisOut@realh.co.uk> wrote in message
news:20090430143457.363074f3@realh.co.uk...
> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?
>
> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>

I'm pretty sure it does but another way would be to use apt-cdrom to add a
cd to apt. The man page tells all but I've never used it, I think the cd you
create has to have the structure of an apt repository.

--
Geoff

Chris Davies · External Since: Apr 13, 2004 Posts: 284

Tony Houghton <h.TakeThisOut@realh.co.uk> wrote:
> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?

Apt uses the package indexes to determine which versions of what packages
are required. These appear to generate the *.bin files in /var/cache/apt
itself, so I think you would need everything from there down, not just
in the archives subdirectory.

Mark Scott · External Since: Apr 07, 2004 Posts: 10

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:34:57 +0100, Tony Houghton wrote:

> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?

I don't know about apt-get, but aptitude (on Debian Lenny at any rate)
behaves the way you're looking for.

--
Mark Scott
mark DeleteThis @codebrewer.com

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 15:09:48 +0100
"Geoffrey Clements" <geoffrey.clementsNO.DeleteThis@SPAMbaesystems.com> wrote:

> "Tony Houghton" <h.DeleteThis@realh.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:20090430143457.363074f3@realh.co.uk...
> > When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> > everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> > there already?
> >
> > I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> > slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> > could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> > to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>
> I'm pretty sure it does but another way would be to use apt-cdrom to add a
> cd to apt. The man page tells all but I've never used it, I think the cd you
> create has to have the structure of an apt repository.

The difficult bit is getting the layout of the CD/DVD right and man
apt-cdrom doesn't cover that bit. I'd want to create my own disc because
I did use an Ubuntu alternate install disc last time, but it still took
several hours downloading packages not on the disc.

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 16:09:28 +0100
Chris Davies <chris-usenet RemoveThis @roaima.co.uk> wrote:

> Tony Houghton <h RemoveThis @realh.co.uk> wrote:
> > When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> > everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> > there already?
>
> Apt uses the package indexes to determine which versions of what packages
> are required. These appear to generate the *.bin files in /var/cache/apt
> itself, so I think you would need everything from there down, not just
> in the archives subdirectory.

It looks like 'apt-get check' might help there?

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Will Kemp · External Since: Jan 13, 2009 Posts: 16

Tony Houghton wrote:
> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?
>
> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

An easy way, depending on exactly what you're doing, should be to just
install the packages using

dpkg -i <filename> <filename> <filename> ....

No need to worry about apt at all.

--
http://NovemberEchoRomeoDelta.com

Bruce Stephens · External Since: Aug 19, 2004 Posts: 186

Tony Houghton <h.DeleteThis@realh.co.uk> writes:

> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?

Yes and no. It downloads package lists and things to decide what to
upgrade/install. Those end up in /var/cache/apt and
/var/lib/apt/lists (I don't understand the details well enough to
suggest how they're set up). If such packages happen to be in
/var/cache/apt/archives then it'll use them rather than downloading.
Indeed, you can do "apt-get upgrade --download-only", and then (some
time later) do "apt-get upgrade", and it won't download anything the
second time.

> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

Well, they could do "apt-get upgrade --print-uris" (or dist-upgrade
--print-uris), then you could download the packages and stick them in
/var/cache/apt/archives. (Probably better to have them do "apt-get
update" first, come to think of it.)

Dick Georgeson · External Since: Aug 09, 2004 Posts: 28

We have evidence that on Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:34:57 +0100, Tony Houghton
wrote:

> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?
>
> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I could
> download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way to load
> them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

Yup, I used to do just that when I had 3 machines to update on dialup
(since 2 Debian stables ago at least). Copy var/cache/apt/archives across
and update/upgrade the 'slave' machine. There always seem to be some
extras but it does the bulk of it.

--
Dick Georgeson
Whenever you find that you are on the side of the majority, it is time
to reform. -- Mark Twain

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 21:50:22 +0100
Will Kemp <will DeleteThis @xxxx.swaggie.net> wrote:

> Tony Houghton wrote:
> > When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> > everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> > there already?
> >
> > I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> > slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> > could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> > to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>
> An easy way, depending on exactly what you're doing, should be to just
> install the packages using
>
> dpkg -i <filename> <filename> <filename> ....
>
> No need to worry about apt at all.

The trouble is there are dire warnings about trying to upgrade Ubuntu to
a newer generation by other means than using the upgrade tool built into
update-manager. I'm hoping that it's based on apt so that what works for
apt-get will also work for update-manager. I know it does work with
apt-cdrom compatible discs so I might have to resort to learning how to
build one.

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 22:42:23 +0100
Bruce Stephens <bruce+usenet@cenderis.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Tony Houghton <h RemoveThis @realh.co.uk> writes:
>
> > When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> > everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> > there already?
>
> Yes and no. It downloads package lists and things to decide what to
> upgrade/install. Those end up in /var/cache/apt and
> /var/lib/apt/lists (I don't understand the details well enough to
> suggest how they're set up). If such packages happen to be in
> /var/cache/apt/archives then it'll use them rather than downloading.
> Indeed, you can do "apt-get upgrade --download-only", and then (some
> time later) do "apt-get upgrade", and it won't download anything the
> second time.

I don't quite follow. Is it enough to just drop the packages into
/var/cache/apt/archives?

> > I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> > slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> > could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> > to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>
> Well, they could do "apt-get upgrade --print-uris" (or dist-upgrade
> --print-uris), then you could download the packages and stick them in
> /var/cache/apt/archives. (Probably better to have them do "apt-get
> update" first, come to think of it.)

Oh, I didn't know about --print-uris, that should make it quite a bit
easier. I was just going to use the list of package names it usually
prints and then run apt-get in a debootstrap chroot to download them.
--print-uris does make the timing more critical though.

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

The Real Doctor · External Since: Apr 29, 2009 Posts: 3

On 30 Apr, 14:34, Tony Houghton <h... RemoveThis @realh.co.uk> wrote:

> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

If this is a distribution upgrade, all you have to do is download the
"alternate" CD image and upgrade from that. The fastest way I have
found is to copy the iso to a stick, mount it to the CDROM (mount -o
loopback /media/disk/whatever.iso /media/cdrom0) and then run the
cdromupgrade utility ("sudo sh /cdrom/cdromupgrade").

I have six PCs/laptops running Ubuntu here and always do the upgrades
this way. Full details at http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading

Ian

Bruce Stephens · External Since: Aug 19, 2004 Posts: 186

Tony Houghton <h.TakeThisOut@realh.co.uk> writes:

[...]

> I don't quite follow. Is it enough to just drop the packages into
> /var/cache/apt/archives?

There are two things: the package lists, which tell apt what packages
are available (and so which to upgrade to); and the packages
themselves.

There's some danger if you copy the packages from one machine to
another that the package lists will be different. In that case apt
will (probably) want to download some packages.

That's why I suggest getting the list of packages from their machines.

Likely it won't matter that much, though: it's not that they *can't*
download packages, just that you want to reduce the downloading.

So just copying the packages is probably fine. (Unless the two
machines are radically different, of course. Even in that case it
won't do any harm.)

[...]

Tim Woodall · External Since: May 22, 2006 Posts: 14

On Fri, 1 May 2009 00:14:04 +0100,
Tony Houghton <h DeleteThis @realh.co.uk> wrote:
>
> The trouble is there are dire warnings about trying to upgrade Ubuntu to
> a newer generation by other means than using the upgrade tool built into
> update-manager. I'm hoping that it's based on apt so that what works for
> apt-get will also work for update-manager. I know it does work with
> apt-cdrom compatible discs so I might have to resort to learning how to
> build one.
>
Or how about apt-mirror?

If you don't want to include everything have a look at:

http://www.woodall.me.uk/cdinstaller/

in particular:
http://www.woodall.me.uk/cdinstaller/CDinstaller/scripts/make_aptmirror

(I've put up the tarball and also expanded it - and if you spot anything
in there that I might prefer not to be published then can you let me
know... I think it's all ok - my public SSH key is there if you want to
give me access to your machines Wink

)

WARNING: There are some EXCEEDINGLY dangerous scripts here if you run
them as root without understanding them first. I don't think
make_aptmirror is dangerous but ...

Tim.

--
God said, "div D = rho, div B = 0, curl E = - @B/@t, curl H = J + @D/@t,"
and there was light.

http://www.woodall.me.uk/

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Fri, 1 May 2009 01:51:44 -0700 (PDT)
The Real Doctor <ian.groups RemoveThis @btinternet.com> wrote:

> On 30 Apr, 14:34, Tony Houghton <h... RemoveThis @realh.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> > slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> > could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> > to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>
> If this is a distribution upgrade, all you have to do is download the
> "alternate" CD image and upgrade from that. The fastest way I have
> found is to copy the iso to a stick, mount it to the CDROM (mount -o
> loopback /media/disk/whatever.iso /media/cdrom0) and then run the
> cdromupgrade utility ("sudo sh /cdrom/cdromupgrade").
>
> I have six PCs/laptops running Ubuntu here and always do the upgrades
> this way. Full details at http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading

I think I mentioned I've done that before, it still took too long
really. There isn't enough on the standard CDs.

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Tony Houghton · External Since: Jul 22, 2006 Posts: 113

On Fri, 1 May 2009 10:48:54 +0000 (UTC)
Tim Woodall <devnull.RemoveThis@woodall.me.uk> wrote:

> On Fri, 1 May 2009 00:14:04 +0100,
> Tony Houghton <h.RemoveThis@realh.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> > The trouble is there are dire warnings about trying to upgrade Ubuntu to
> > a newer generation by other means than using the upgrade tool built into
> > update-manager. I'm hoping that it's based on apt so that what works for
> > apt-get will also work for update-manager. I know it does work with
> > apt-cdrom compatible discs so I might have to resort to learning how to
> > build one.
> >
> Or how about apt-mirror?
>
> If you don't want to include everything have a look at:
>
> http://www.woodall.me.uk/cdinstaller/
>
> in particular:
> http://www.woodall.me.uk/cdinstaller/CDinstaller/scripts/make_aptmirror

Thanks, but I think it confirms for me I'd rather drop the packages into
/var/cache/apt/archives if possible!

--
TH * http://www.realh.co.uk

Will Kemp · External Since: Jan 13, 2009 Posts: 16

Tony Houghton wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 21:50:22 +0100
> Will Kemp <will.DeleteThis@xxxx.swaggie.net> wrote:
>
>> Tony Houghton wrote:
>>> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
>>> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
>>> there already?
>>>
>>> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
>>> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
>>> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
>>> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.
>> An easy way, depending on exactly what you're doing, should be to just
>> install the packages using
>>
>> dpkg -i <filename> <filename> <filename> ....
>>
>> No need to worry about apt at all.
>
> The trouble is there are dire warnings about trying to upgrade Ubuntu to
> a newer generation by other means than using the upgrade tool built into
> update-manager.

Oh. Are you trying to upgrade to a new major version? I would have
thought that would be likely to be a tricky thing to do a the best of
times - without complicating matters by using apt in a non-standard way.

So, yeah, forget dpkg!

--
http://NovemberEchoRomeoDelta.com

Will Kemp · External Since: Jan 13, 2009 Posts: 16

Tony Houghton wrote:
> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?
>
> I want to upgrade Ubuntu on my sisters' PCs and they've both got quite
> slow and/or limited ADSL connections. It would be a lot quicker if I
> could download the packages at my house as long as there's an easy way
> to load them on to my sisters' PCs from a DVD or USB stick.

It sounds like you're setting yourself up for a bit of a nightmare! Why
don't you just take your sister's computer to your place and do the
upgrade there?

--
http://NovemberEchoRomeoDelta.com

alexd · External Since: Dec 15, 2005 Posts: 52

Tony Houghton wrote:

> When apt decides what packages to download does it automatically find
> everything in /var/cache/apt/archives and not download anything that's
> there already?

I've got /var/cache/apt/archives mounted over NFS for this reason and it
seems to work OK.

--
<http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) (UnSoEsNpEaTm@ale.cx)
21:44:04 up 150 days, 22:54, 2 users, load average: 0.01, 0.05, 0.07
My god, said I, with my one liquid eye, am I dreaming, or am I insane?

Nix · External Since: Jul 29, 2004 Posts: 688

On 1 May 2009, Will Kemp told this:

> Tony Houghton wrote:
>> The trouble is there are dire warnings about trying to upgrade Ubuntu to
>> a newer generation by other means than using the upgrade tool built into
>> update-manager.
>
> Oh. Are you trying to upgrade to a new major version? I would have
> thought that would be likely to be a tricky thing to do a the best of
> times - without complicating matters by using apt in a non-standard way.
>
> So, yeah, forget dpkg!

Oh, Debian, what have they done to you? This really should work.