How hot is too hot-what is thermal spec?

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

I am running an AMD 9500 processor in an Asus M3A motherboard. The thermal spec on this processor is 70 degrees Centigrade. With room temp at 80F degrees this processor is running at 66C degrees and the CPU fan is turning at 6000 rpm.
I've added a fan to the case to no avail. Should I be concerned? Mad

drc

zlim · Joined: Mar 11, 2005 Posts: 2636

http://forums.amd.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=11&threadid=25648

What are you using to measure the temperature?

Have you reapplied thermal paste?

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

Hi zlim,
Thanks for the reference. I am using the bios and also a program called Speedfan to measure temps and fan speeds.

I am more concerned with the speed of the CPU fan than the temp. Running at 6000 rpm is likely to shorten the fan life. Since I turn my computer on in the AM and leave it on til bedtime a fan failure could be a problem if I'm not there to catch it.

I have not changed the heat conducting paste on the heat sink. I did remove the side of the case and put an eight inch fan to blow into the case. This dropped the CPU fan speed down to about 4000 rpm and the temp down to 60C degrees. Still pretty fast for the fan.

drc

kenmabmcc

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

Hi Ken,
Since it has been getting overheated I have been turning it off when I leave it. There are two schools of thought about leaving computers on.
One says that the constant heating up and cooling down is harder on the machine than just heating up and cooling down once a day. Also it is supposed to cause cards and memory chips to work loose from their sockets.
The other says long periods of heating are more harmful than the heating up and cooling down. I don't know who is right on this.

drc

kenmabmcc

Hi drc,

I don't know who is right either, but may be in the past it was an issue.
I noticed that when I upgraded my memory, that the chips are held in place with holddowns.
I presume your temperatures are in fahrenheit for your air temperature,
and centigrade for your CPU.
My air temperature ranges from 12C to 25C, and I have been turning this computer,
on and off, several times a day for years.
At the moment the air temperature is 17C,
the motherboard is 27C
and the CPU [AMD Athlon] is 60C.

ken

drwho07 · Joined: Nov 29, 2007 Posts: 1546 Location: Central FL, USA

Well, in the first place, home computers are built with "Hobby Grade" components, (from the lowest bidder) not Mil-Spec or NASA Grade parts that can stand highly elevated temperatures. If you lay your index finger on a part and have to quickly withdraw it, saying "OUCH" then it's too hot.
That includes, CPU's, ram and HD's.

Secondly, the temperature sensors in CPU's and mobo's, HD's, etc. are not calibrated to laboratory standards. They can only give you 'ball-park' readings.

So don't go all crazy over some "Reading" or another.

As for whether to turn off the PC or leave it run.............it's almost nothing but common sense.
What other home appliance do you leave run all the time, even when you're gone? TV? Microwave?

I've seen PC's catch on fire.............you don't want that happening when you're not there to unplug it and put out the flames. Ya think?

I have 13 cooling fans in my own system and sometimes I think that's not even enough. But, my whole system stays at room temperature, no matter how hard I work it.

Remember, "Heat Kills" so don't let it kill your PC.

Keep a cool tool fool !

Doc Cool

goretsky

Hello,

What brand and model of CPU cooler are you using with the AMD 9500 CPU in the ASSU M3A motherboard?

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

goretsky,
I was using the Asus brand of heat sink and fan that came with the processor. It had an aluminum heat sink and an 80mm fan. I have since bought a Coolerator unit with a copper core heat sink and a 90mm fan. That has dropped the temp by 11 degrees and the fan turns at 3300.
Other than being a little more noisy it seems my problem is solved. Thanks for all the comments guys (and girl?).

drc

goretsky

Hello,

One thing to keep in mind is that some CPU fans do run at 6,000 RPM, so the previously-installed model could have been operating within specifications.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

micker377 · Joined: May 27, 2005 Posts: 994

I have similar problems with ambient temperatures. If my computer room goes over 80 degrees F, my CPU has "thermal runaway". I had to install a small window A-C unit to keep the room cool. As long as it is below 80, I'm O.K.

goretsky

Hello,

Most computers are designed to operate in an office environment, which would be a temperature around 70°F. While I would expect a typical office computer (onboard graphics, one hard disk drive, one optical disk drive) to work at higher temperatures, an enthusiast's system, with many disk drives and a discrete graphics card would probably require much higher airflow through the chassis to work at higher temperatures.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

By the way Doc, where did you find room in the case for 13 fans? I have a hard time fitting in four.

drc

drwho07 · Joined: Nov 29, 2007 Posts: 1546 Location: Central FL, USA

Donrc,
I'm glad you asked. Wink

I have three HD's and I've mounted a two-fan cooler on each one.
I've added three case fans to the front of my case, to bring in fresh air.
There is one fan, the stock fan from AMD, on my CPU.
There is a fan on my video card and an exhaust fan in the back frame.
Then there are two fans in the PSU.
OK?

For many years, I've used retail boxed CPU's from AMD that always come with a cooler sufficient to keep the CPU operating within specifications.
That is........IF the heatsink and fan are kept clean, with regular maintenance.
NO CPU cooler will do its job properly if the heatsink is jammed up with dirt.

I have pictures of how I've implemented some of the fans, if you're interested.

The Doctor Cool

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

Yes Doc I would like to see your fan pictures.

drc

drwho07 · Joined: Nov 29, 2007 Posts: 1546 Location: Central FL, USA

OK, but remember..... YOU ASKED FOR IT !

<<-- click to expand

When I began this build, the first thing I did was add the big exhaust fan in the back panel.

<<-- click to expand

Then I cut in this (red) fan in the upper front panels to cool my main HD, which I've mounted on spacers in the top 5.25" drive bay. You can also see the cooler under the HD.

Note the grill-work in the lower front of the case, for two more fans. Too much grill-work = too little air flow. So.........

<<-- click to expand

Snip, Snip and the grill is gone. I installed two more case fans behind those openings, to cool my two HD's in the lower drive bays.

The Finished Product :

<<-- click to expand

Disregard the fan in the left side panel.......... I almost NEVER put that panel on my PC. If installed, that would be fan # 14.

I installed 1/2" felt feet under the PC to raise it up off of the desktop and opened up the grill in the plastic front panel, to allow for more air flow.

Any time I like, I can reach into the PC and lay my index finger (calibrated heat sensor) on any part of the PC and it will be no more than warm to the touch.

I live in Florida, with NO central air conditioning. It's not unusual for the room temp to go up into the nineties on a hot summer day. But still I have no heat problems with my PC.

Thermal runaway???? I have NEVER seen this failure on any AMD processor, going all the way back to the 386.
AMD was the first CPU that I'm aware of, that incorporates a circuit to actually slow down the clock rate of the CPU when it gets hot.
When running at a slower clock rate, the CPU will generate less heat.

I had to replace the CPU fan on a customer's PC one day, a few years back.
The fan had stalled and actually burned up. I burned my hand on the heatsink, it was so hot, but the AMD CPU was still running, albeit, a bit slow. Wink

After cooling down for a while and getting a new cooling fan, the AMD CPU came right back up to normal operating speed.

Well, that's about it. I hope you enjoyed the slide show.

Cheers Mates!
The Doctor Cool

drwho07 · Joined: Nov 29, 2007 Posts: 1546 Location: Central FL, USA

Addendum:

Since loosing three HD's to heat exhaustion in one summer ( quite a few years ago now), I've been putting two-fan coolers on all my HD's.

By trial and error, I found that when the cooler is mounted right to the bottom of the drive, there is insufficient room for the hot air to escape from the fan assembly.
I spaced the cooler away from the drive with the 1/4" brass spacers used to mount motherboards to the case, this increased the air flow considerably and the cooling increased measurably. So now, that's the only way I install a HD cooler.

I've shown this before, and those who have tried it have reported very favorable results.

Keeping a HD constantly at room temperature, prevents the stresses caused by heating and cooling that can destroy a drive in time.

Works for me! Wink

The Doctor Cool

donrc · Joined: Feb 16, 2003 Posts: 882

Doc,
Very interesting. One other question: When mounting case fans do you have them drawing air into the case or pushing air out of the case?

drc

drwho07 · Joined: Nov 29, 2007 Posts: 1546 Location: Central FL, USA

I always try to keep fresh air coming in the front or sides of the case and exiting out the back, either through the exhaust fan or through the power supply.
Added air flow helps to keep the PSU cool as well.

I hope you liked my photo album.

The Doctor Cool