|
|
| Next: Sept 11 families denounce Guantanamo war crimes t.. |
| Author |
Message |
tony7914
Joined: Dec 24, 2004
Posts: 4965
Location: Peru Indiana
|
 Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 1:00 pm Post subject: Where To Draw The Bailout Line? |
|
|
| Quote: |
| The bailout-nation saga continued this week, as the little-three carmakers from Detroit drove to Washington to plead for a $34 billion federal package to save themselves from bankruptcy and insolvency................ |
| Quote: |
| Various polling surveys say bailout nation, and a federal rescue for autos in particular, is very unpopular. At least 60 percent are polling against a bailout. The TARP bailout of banks is increasingly unpopular. |
| Quote: |
Corker wants Detroit to have the exact same compensation levels as the Japanese transplants in the non-union Southern states. That means moving hourly labor costs down from roughly $70 to $48. It means reopening the UAW contracts that have created the huge pay gap between Toyota and GM. It means putting an end to excessive pension and health-care benefits.
According to professor Mark Perry of the University of Michigan, GM health-care benefits add $1,500 to the price of every vehicle, while pension costs add another $700 per car. That will have to end. The lucrative jobs bank that pays laid-off workers 95 percent of their compensation also will have to stop. And bondholders will have to be satisfied with a complete renegotiation of GM's $62 billion in debt, including the union retiree health-care fund that is underfunded by $30 billion. |
Source.
The union will never go for any of this and congress has no business playing "Bankruptcy Court" One more thing, Congress has no authority over the Union and only a bankruptcy court can rework their contract unless both sides agree to renegotiate and I can't see the UAW giving up this much for any reason. Best to let the Court handle this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
tony7914
Joined: Dec 24, 2004
Posts: 4965
Location: Peru Indiana
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 1:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Detroit: Same Old, Same Old [Jim Manzi]
Andrew Sullivan points to an article by Jonathan Cohn in the current TNR arguing for the proposed automotive bailout.
The core of Cohn's argument is that the Big 3 are turning around, and that the bailout will give them time to complete their transformation to competitive companies. While this might be true, it is very hard to accept that Cohn provides any compelling evidence that the future is about to become very different than the past several decades of Big 3 performance. |
Source.
I posted this because it helps explain the big 3's profitability a bit. It's highly doubtful bailout loans will do anything more than waste taxpayers money. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tony7914
Joined: Dec 24, 2004
Posts: 4965
Location: Peru Indiana
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
I think the bailout line was just drawn.
| Quote: |
Bailout dead, automakers in search of a lifeline
By KEN THOMAS and JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS
Associated Press
December 12, 2008
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Their efforts in Congress squashed, U.S. automakers are depending upon a reluctant White House to quickly provide a multibillion lifeline to help them avoid imminent collapse.
General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC, which have said they could run out of cash within weeks, have few options left after the dramatic defeat in the Senate of a $14 billion bailout for the domestic auto industry.
Its demise late Thursday prompted immediate calls from lawmakers in both parties for the Bush administration to tap into the $700 billion Wall Street bailout to rescue the beleaguered auto industry. The bill failed after talks broke down over the refusal of the United Auto Workers union to meet Republican demands for aggressive wage reductions..... |
Source.
| Quote: |
Without Union Concessions, Bankruptcy Better Than A Bailout, Republicans Say
Friday, December 12, 2008
By Susan Jones, Senior Editor
CNSNews.com – Congressional Republicans blocked consideration of a $14-billion federal loan for the auto industry Thursday night.
Republicans leaders said they want the U.S. auto industry to survive and thrive, but they also insist that a multi-billion-dollar taxpayer loan is not the only option. There’s also federal bankruptcy protection.
According to the Associated Press, the deal stalled over the United Auto Workers’ refusal to agree to wage cuts before their current contract expires in 2011.... |
Source. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CowpokeBob
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: South Carolina, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 7:33 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
|
|
| tony7914 wrote: |
I think the bailout line was just drawn.
| Quote: |
Bailout dead, automakers in search of a lifeline
By KEN THOMAS and JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS
Associated Press
December 12, 2008
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Their efforts in Congress squashed, U.S. automakers are depending upon a reluctant White House to quickly provide a multibillion lifeline to help them avoid imminent collapse.
General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC, which have said they could run out of cash within weeks, have few options left after the dramatic defeat in the Senate of a $14 billion bailout for the domestic auto industry.
Its demise late Thursday prompted immediate calls from lawmakers in both parties for the Bush administration to tap into the $700 billion Wall Street bailout to rescue the beleaguered auto industry. The bill failed after talks broke down over the refusal of the United Auto Workers union to meet Republican demands for aggressive wage reductions..... |
Source.
| Quote: |
Without Union Concessions, Bankruptcy Better Than A Bailout, Republicans Say
Friday, December 12, 2008
By Susan Jones, Senior Editor
CNSNews.com – Congressional Republicans blocked consideration of a $14-billion federal loan for the auto industry Thursday night.
Republicans leaders said they want the U.S. auto industry to survive and thrive, but they also insist that a multi-billion-dollar taxpayer loan is not the only option. There’s also federal bankruptcy protection.
According to the Associated Press, the deal stalled over the United Auto Workers’ refusal to agree to wage cuts before their current contract expires in 2011.... |
Source. |
I commend the brave few republicans who stood thier ground on the bail-out of the auto union. In the end it will likely be a futile gesture since it sounds like Bush is going to screw up and give them the money. But then he has bungled the whole bailout process so far so it shouldn't be a surprise. And even if Bush comes to his senses and doesn't give the go ahead to the loan its a sure bet Obama will when he takes office. Either way the union is going to get its money. Just like they did in the case of the window company in Illinois. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tony7914
Joined: Dec 24, 2004
Posts: 4965
Location: Peru Indiana
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:17 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
|
|
| CowpokeBob wrote: |
| tony7914 wrote: |
I think the bailout line was just drawn.
| Quote: |
Bailout dead, automakers in search of a lifeline
By KEN THOMAS and JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS
Associated Press
December 12, 2008
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Their efforts in Congress squashed, U.S. automakers are depending upon a reluctant White House to quickly provide a multibillion lifeline to help them avoid imminent collapse.
General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC, which have said they could run out of cash within weeks, have few options left after the dramatic defeat in the Senate of a $14 billion bailout for the domestic auto industry.
Its demise late Thursday prompted immediate calls from lawmakers in both parties for the Bush administration to tap into the $700 billion Wall Street bailout to rescue the beleaguered auto industry. The bill failed after talks broke down over the refusal of the United Auto Workers union to meet Republican demands for aggressive wage reductions..... |
Source.
| Quote: |
Without Union Concessions, Bankruptcy Better Than A Bailout, Republicans Say
Friday, December 12, 2008
By Susan Jones, Senior Editor
CNSNews.com – Congressional Republicans blocked consideration of a $14-billion federal loan for the auto industry Thursday night.
Republicans leaders said they want the U.S. auto industry to survive and thrive, but they also insist that a multi-billion-dollar taxpayer loan is not the only option. There’s also federal bankruptcy protection.
According to the Associated Press, the deal stalled over the United Auto Workers’ refusal to agree to wage cuts before their current contract expires in 2011.... |
Source. |
I commend the brave few republicans who stood thier ground on the bail-out of the auto union. In the end it will likely be a futile gesture since it sounds like Bush is going to screw up and give them the money. But then he has bungled the whole bailout process so far so it shouldn't be a surprise. And even if Bush comes to his senses and doesn't give the go ahead to the loan its a sure bet Obama will when he takes office. Either way the union is going to get its money. Just like they did in the case of the window company in Illinois. |
I saw that but didn't have time to post it, my bad. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
micker377
Joined: May 27, 2005
Posts: 993
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:27 am Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
|
|
"Just like they did in the case of the window company in Illinois."
That was a completely different case. That company was found to have broken Federal Law (60 days notice). The automakers have had plenty of time to argue their case! They haven't broken any laws (yet!). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
swordofdestiny
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
Posts: 164
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:01 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
|
|
| You know, they're talking about how these bailouts are supposed to benefit us, the taxpayers. How? Where's my cut? Why should I be forced to give my money to all these people who couldn't manage their own business!? Why should we put money into something that is failing and seems likely to fail even with the added money? I wouldn't, but you know I guess the government knows how to use my money better than I do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CowpokeBob
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: South Carolina, USA
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 4:17 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
|
|
| micker377 wrote: |
"Just like they did in the case of the window company in Illinois."
That was a completely different case. That company was found to have broken Federal Law (60 days notice). The automakers have had plenty of time to argue their case! They haven't broken any laws (yet!). |
Neither did Bank of America. The window company declared that it was going out of business after it couldn't get a renewal of its line of credit from Bank of America. The window company allegedly violated federal law by doing so and yet they were not the ones held responsible. Bank of America, which had no relationship to the company other than to loan it money was attacked and forced to make a deal by the union and the state of Illinois. The bank settled by giving the company a multi-million dollar loan which the company will likely default on adding to the financial burdens of Bank of America. How is it we are going to hold the banks responsible for thier financial troubles when it is the government that is forcing them into bad deals like this one. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
| |
|
|
General