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rovingcowboy
Joined: Jan 26, 2003
Posts: 1279
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 Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 6:52 pm Post subject: Clarks slam of McCain and Obama's Okay donkey of it. |
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did you hear what was said by ex general Clark about John McCain.
he said just cause he was a pilot and shot down in to be a POW. does not make
him able to be commander and chief., that was then thought of as being an
un patriotic statement by Clark who is for Obama.
and then today Obama said the statement by Clark was not any different then what was said about Kerry
in the last presidential elections, can you believe that?
he's trying to be president and he says a war hero is no different then a traitor.
we know Kerry went to see the enemy in another country doing the Vietnam war,
and they were the same enemy that was holding McCain as a POW.
and we know that Kerry threw away his purple heart,
we have both those things caught on film. and Kerry wrote an anti American book.
so knowing those items it sounds like Obama was infact calling McCain the same traitor
as Kerry
its not only more things to keep the warning flag up we should stop Obama from winning
by voting in John McCain.
edited this because i had the wrong name down for the traitor i had first said it was kelly cause i forgot it was kerry.
Last edited by rovingcowboy on Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Ranting aside, Clark's comments were pathetic, but that's what we can expect from the surrogates in this election cycle. This is the typical tactic of allowing the surrogate attack while allowing the candidate to appear to be better than that. Obama's done it before, as has McCain, so it's a little hard to get upset by the tactic.
My only issue with this is that it's more politics as usual, which is again not "change".
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Sgt Schultz
Joined: Dec 07, 2002
Posts: 7378
Location: St. Louis area
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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| I disagree with the way Clark went about it and some of the other things he is alluding to but he does ask a legitimate question: does the fact that John McCain was in the military and a POW qualify him to be president? I say that because the ads in Missouri that McCain is running right now are suggesting that very line of reasoning. That because his father was an Admiral and that he was a POW he is the man to keep us safe. It runs 2 to 3 times a night during the local news cast. |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:39 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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No, it's not a legitimate question.
McCain hasn't been saying "vote for me, I was a POW". His service to his country is part of his qualifications, it is not his only qualification. Framing the "debate" the way Clark did, and you echoed, is a smear. And guess what - it looks like it worked; Obama is the "good guy" for denouncing Clark, but you're agreeing with him. Again, typical politics from the guy who was supposed to be different.
And to turn this around, what has Obama done that qualifies him to be President? He's already proven that his theme - "Change" - is a lie. Or his recent commercials - "vote for me, my Grandma's white" - how does that qualify him to be president? I'll answer that - it doesn't, it's just part of who he is, part of his qualifications. But if someone dared say anything about that commercial, they'd be shot! |
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Sgt Schultz
Joined: Dec 07, 2002
Posts: 7378
Location: St. Louis area
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| xavierx wrote: |
No, it's not a legitimate question.
McCain hasn't been saying "vote for me, I was a POW". His service to his country is part of his qualifications, it is not his only qualification. Framing the "debate" the way Clark did, and you echoed, is a smear. And guess what - it looks like it worked; Obama is the "good guy" for denouncing Clark, but you're agreeing with him. Again, typical politics from the guy who was supposed to be different.
And to turn this around, what has Obama done that qualifies him to be President? He's already proven that his theme - "Change" - is a lie. Or his recent commercials - "vote for me, my Grandma's white" - how does that qualify him to be president? I'll answer that - it doesn't, it's just part of who he is, part of his qualifications. But if someone dared say anything about that commercial, they'd be shot! |
This article sums up my feelings on this:
CJR: Attacking McCain's Military Record - What Wesley Clark really sai...how the |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:09 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3646518189100350552&q=clar...ccain&a
The actual video. Clark was trying to say that McCain has no experience to be President, but that somehow Obama does. There's no truth to that statement. He's just doing what surrogates do - attack the opposition so that the candidate can be the "good guy" while still getting you to think what they want.
As I said, the only issue to me is that this is typical politics from the "agent of change". And unfortunately it worked, which is why it is so typical. |
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clhenry
Joined: Feb 13, 2003
Posts: 9051
Location: West by god Virginia
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:19 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| Quote: |
| Clark was trying to say that McCain has no experience to be President |
Link
| Quote: |
| He was elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in 1982. After serving two terms, he was elected to the U.S. Senate in 1986, winning re-election easily in 1992, 1998, and 2004 |
Looks like 26 years of experience to me. |
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Sgt Schultz
Joined: Dec 07, 2002
Posts: 7378
Location: St. Louis area
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:25 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| clhenry wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Clark was trying to say that McCain has no experience to be President |
Link
| Quote: |
| He was elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in 1982. After serving two terms, he was elected to the U.S. Senate in 1986, winning re-election easily in 1992, 1998, and 2004 |
Looks like 26 years of experience to me. |
That was what I was saying. I didn't agree with Clark alluding to that McCain didn't have the experience to be president. What I did agree with is that having military experience does not automatically qualify you to hold that office. The ad that McCain is running in Missouri right now that I see every night only talks about his military experience. If that was the case I served in the military longer than McCain so I guess I'm qualified too. |
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clhenry
Joined: Feb 13, 2003
Posts: 9051
Location: West by god Virginia
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:59 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| Quote: |
| The ad that McCain is running in Missouri right now that I see every night only talks about his military experience. |
And if he runs on just that platform, he has no chance. |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:41 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| clhenry wrote: |
| Quote: |
| The ad that McCain is running in Missouri right now that I see every night only talks about his military experience. |
And if he runs on just that platform, he has no chance. |
That was my point of why Clark's comment and the question raised is not valid - McCain isn't running on just his military experience, it's just part of who he is and his qualifications. He's not ignoring the past 26 years. |
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rovingcowboy
Joined: Jan 26, 2003
Posts: 1279
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:33 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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no ranting is not to be but aside that is the point of the post.
Clark and obama are both ranting and talking out the sides of their mouths with a fork tongue.
i for one am not wanting a war on american soil again.
which is what will happen if McCain is not elected.
because obama said he will pull the troops out. and in his own words in his book he said he would side with the muslims.
thats anti american to me, and makes obama the traitor just like kerry. |
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ejward
Joined: Jan 06, 2003
Posts: 7054
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:50 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| rovingcowboy wrote: |
no ranting is not to be but aside that is the point of the post.
Clark and obama are both ranting and talking out the sides of their mouths with a fork tongue.
i for one am not wanting a war on american soil again.
which is what will happen if McCain is not elected.
because obama said he will pull the troops out. and in his own words in his book he said he would side with the muslims.
thats anti american to me, and makes obama the traitor just like kerry. |
Which religion would someone have to side with to qualify as American in your eyes? |
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mommabear
Joined: Feb 20, 2003
Posts: 6319
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:03 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| Quote: |
Clark’s argument that military service is not sufficient alone to be president is an argument that has been made by McCain himself:
- During an interview with National Journal, John McCain was asked if “military service inherently makes somebody better equipped to be commander-in-chief.” McCain said, “Absolutely not…I absolutely don’t believe that it’s necessary.” [National Journal, 2/15/2003]
- I believe that military service is the most honorable endeavor an American may undertake. But I’ve never believed that lack of military service disqualifies one from occupying positions of political leadership or as Commander and Chief. In America, the people are sovereign, and they decide who is and is not qualified to lead us. [American Legion Speech, 9/7/1999]
- Earlier this year at Washington’s Gridiron Club, where humor is the required fare, McCain lay bare what underlies his candidacy. Wearing a jacket outlandishly festooned with dozens of fake military medals, McCain said, “The question I ask myself every morning while shaving in front of the mirror is: OK, John, you’re an incredible war hero, an inspiration to all Americans. But what qualifies you to be president of the United States?” [Minneapolis Star Tribune, 11/7/1999]
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/07/01/mccain-v-clark-qualifications/
John McCain: Changing The Definition Of “Experienced”
http://mccainsource.com/mccain_fact_check?id=0017 |
Seems McCain perhaps doth protest too much regarding experience, especially military experience. Of course, that was then and this is now. |
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mommabear
Joined: Feb 20, 2003
Posts: 6319
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| rovingcowboy wrote: |
no ranting is not to be but aside that is the point of the post.
Clark and obama are both ranting and talking out the sides of their mouths with a fork tongue.
i for one am not wanting a war on american soil again.
which is what will happen if McCain is not elected.
because obama said he will pull the troops out. and in his own words in his book he said he would side with the muslims.
thats anti american to me, and makes obama the traitor just like kerry. |
I remember some buzz about "siding with the Muslims" not too long ago, but I can't remember enough to find it on Google. I think I know the context of what Obama may have said. Maybe you'd like to explain that a little more and then I can find out exactly what he said, in context, to set the record straight.
Oh, and btw, if McCain is not elected, what kind of war are you talking about?
I know that if McCain is elected there will be another war, maybe more, because that's all he's got. But not on American soil. |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:59 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| mommabear wrote: |
...
Seems McCain perhaps doth protest too much regarding experience, especially military experience. Of course, that was then and this is now. |
McCain never said that military experience is all that qualified him for President. And Clark isn't the first to say similar things about McCain for Obama. This is a pattern of behavior from Obama's surrogates, and as I said, the only issue to me is that this is typical politics from the "agent of change". |
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kenmabmcc
Joined: Nov 20, 2003
Posts: 8181
Location: Dunedin, New Zealand.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:59 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| rovingcowboy wrote: |
i for one am not wanting a war on american soil again.
which is what will happen if McCain is not elected.
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The last war on American soil was the civil war 1861-1865.
Are you saying there will be a civil war if McCain is not elected ?
 |
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xavierx
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Posts: 5427
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:48 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| Perhaps you missed the fact that Terrorists have been at war with us for many years, and attacked us here multiple times ... |
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kenmabmcc
Joined: Nov 20, 2003
Posts: 8181
Location: Dunedin, New Zealand.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:26 pm Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| xavierx wrote: |
| Perhaps you missed the fact that Terrorists have been at war with us for many years, and attacked us here multiple times ... |
Terrorist attacks are not a war,
they are just criminal acts.
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rovingcowboy
Joined: Jan 26, 2003
Posts: 1279
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:31 am Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| kenmabmcc wrote: |
| xavierx wrote: |
| Perhaps you missed the fact that Terrorists have been at war with us for many years, and attacked us here multiple times ... |
Terrorist attacks are not a war,
they are just criminal acts.
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hogwash .
they have declared war on us they want to wipe the Americans off the face of the earth why in bloody h ...l can't we declare war on them.  |
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rovingcowboy
Joined: Jan 26, 2003
Posts: 1279
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:34 am Post subject: [Login to view extended thread Info.] |
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| mommabear wrote: |
| rovingcowboy wrote: |
no ranting is not to be but aside that is the point of the post.
Clark and obama are both ranting and talking out the sides of their mouths with a fork tongue.
i for one am not wanting a war on american soil again.
which is what will happen if McCain is not elected.
because obama said he will pull the troops out. and in his own words in his book he said he would side with the muslims.
thats anti american to me, and makes obama the traitor just like kerry. |
you can't find it cause they bullied the web search engines and page hosts to remove it from the web.
it was in one of his two books.
I remember some buzz about "siding with the Muslims" not too long ago, but I can't remember enough to find it on Google. I think I know the context of what Obama may have said. Maybe you'd like to explain that a little more and then I can find out exactly what he said, in context, to set the record straight.
Oh, and btw, if McCain is not elected, what kind of war are you talking about?
I know that if McCain is elected there will be another war, maybe more, because that's all he's got. But not on American soil. |
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