64 bit vrs 32, & a ghost in my machine

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

good morning all you fine folk.

i've got a problem(s). it's called 64 bit. + av & firewall
my machine is:
HP dv4 notebook
Vista home premium (arrrgggh!!)
Intel Core dual CPU T5800 @ 2Ghz
Ram 4 G
64 bit OS

kaspersky wouldn't load because it hates avg8. now, i had Removed avg8 as requested by KIS. then i installed KIS. oooops!! flashed on my screen was "avg 8" found.
so i went searching. couldn't find a thing. not one lil shred of avg 8.
rebooted cuz a long pc life teaches us: it's as necessary as breathing.....
installed...almost...KIS. "avg 8" found. i used the wee lil progy that says it removes all remnents of avg 8
many grey hairs later....... i realized, i've got a ghost in my machine. it's name is AVG 8. i used to be very fond of that program.........
and zone alarm won't work on 64 bit. dbl arrgh!

to pacify myself, i d/l'd some old games i'd enjoyed on XP and even a mahjong that'd worked on my 33mghz with the turbo button.
64 Bit kicked 'em to the floor, then out the door! not 64 compatible.

so guys n gals, i need to get the avg8 ghost gone (hiding in restore points??)
and can i turn off the 64 taking it to 32 bit??? i really do like that mahjong....and am still searchin for the Old dominos. they better fit my reaction-time *sigh*, an Alien Machine can never sit on my desk (love the design tho).

if anyone has the answers, it'd be ya'all.....kaspersky didn't.

a very frustrated............. granni

zlim · Joined: Mar 11, 2005 Posts: 2747

http://freeforum.avg.com/read.php?13,121635,backpage=,sv=
Run AVG v8 installer but select uninstall

I'm not sure what little wee program you ran to uninstall it.

After you've done that and rebooted, run CCleaner
http://majorgeeks.com/download4191.html
and use the registry cleaner.
When it asks if you want save the old registry, be sure you select Yes and put it somewhere that you can easily locate it.

If something else seems broken, then just click the .reg that was saved and your registry will be back to the way it was before it was cleaned.

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

ahhh, sorry i wasn't clear on the whats n hows.

initially i'd used the windows 'remove program' under control panel.
then rebooted.
then tried to install kaspersky, and was informed that some of avg8 was still present.
since i'd already read all of the kaspersky site re their product, i'd seen the referrence to smaller progs that would clean up remainders of removed antivirus progs. i then d/l'd that....for avg8.
it's called avgremover.....linked from the kaspersky site.

at the top of the page belatedly, i saw that one had to choose between 32 or 64 bit. however, in d/ling the 64 bit, it turned out to be the same doggoned 32 bit remover ......which i began to suspect was now yelling at me (am so sensitive)
"2009-01-13 03:50:00,184 WORK Wrong application platform. Use corresponding application version for 32bit or 64bit systems"

three times d/ling the '64bit' got me the same msg. the 64 bit remover for avg is.....a 32 bit, which won't work on the 64 bit.

so, the ghost remains in the machine. and i realized i'd probably not be able to have the kis progy after all.

then, i reinstalled AVG8, cuz ya gotta have some protection.

only now....... apparently i'll forever only have windows defender which does not fill me with warm fuzzies at all.

i will try your above suggestion. and i thank you for taking the time to try to help me. if it were summer, i'd be outside putzin with the garden instead of stuck inside fussin with the ....laptop/notebook.

"grandma! you've Got to get a Laptop!!"
so i did. younguns know best with these new fangled things ya know. she still fixes my vcr. (dang clock's blinkin again!)

will get back with ya on the fix you suggested. thanks again.......

granni

goretsky · Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 3:53 am Post subject:

Hello,

If you contact Kaspersky's technical support department they should be able to explain what objects from AVG their anti-virus programs installer is looking for and assist you in removing them from your system.

Try uninstalling AVG one more time, following Kaspersky's instructions for removing any remnants, then install Kaspersky Anti Virus and you should be up and running with the new anti-virus program.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

dear Goretsky, and Zlim,

oy........

Zlim, i did do as you suggested........to no avail. but, i Do very much appreciate your trying to help me. *sigh*, it'd been a longgggg night trying again to get kaspersky to work. and it kept on telling me that it'd found Avg8.
i gave up just before getting 'keyboard face', and toddled off to bed. not too sure, but i think i was dreamin in hex.

mr. Goretsky, ahhh precious, i had contacted kaspersky's support folks. that's where they'd ended up (by email 3) sending me the remover for 64bit for, avg8.
which did NOT find that lurking hidden snaggle-toothed fragment of a file.......avg8. That's when i came to Lockergnome to find the brains who Really know stuff. if it could be fixed, i knew ya'all could fix it.

unfortunately kaspersky will not be receiving any pennies from me for their program, which i'd almost drooled over.

then, i redown-loaded AVG8, and begging it's forgiveness..... reinstalled it.

so dear geeks n gurus, my laptop has avg8 and all it's updates, but only windows defender for a firewall..... cuz zone alarm hasn't established a fond working relationship with.....*battlestar gallactica character's fav word Shocked

* 64bit machines.

and, i don't know of any other trustworthy firewalls. *a for real heavy-sigh*

granni

Baby_Tux · Joined: Mar 06, 2007 Posts: 1242

How good / comfortable are you at "hacking" the registry?
Sounds to me like this may be what it will take. But since you have a working solution, my guess is that you'd sooner just leave well enough alone!?!?!

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

ahh baby tux, i did d/l the higher rated reg fixers from majorgeeks dot com. and they found a bit. after which i'd rebooted.....and retried installing kaspersky which Again said that it'd found avg8. didya know that after hours of that dang msg flashin on the screen ....... a gal feels like her pc is yellin at her?!

all of this was last thursday - saturday morning. two nights of stayin up til the week hours of the morning. sat morn, hubby passed me in the kitchen and grinnin said, "still haven't figured it out, eh?" oy.......

now, a workin solution? hmmm. yeah, it works. not perfectly. but, it works.
however...........to Have to make do, as opposed to doin what i wanna do, jes irritates the bejeebers outta me.

it's now become a naggin thing. kinda like, a choice removed. a choice that Should be there.

today, i talked with my daughter who said purty much what you did baby_tux. and she also asked about 'the registry'. she knows that the registry is a 'no granni land'.

no dear babetux, i'm not terribly comfy with goin diggin into the registry. i had used the windows reg edit.......and stressed the whole few moments of it.
yeah, i know....... to those of you who do this all the time, it's a piece-a-cake.
the Registry is one place that i've never been comfy. i'll dig through files and read their innards, but not........the registry. *realizes granni has issues*

and i sooooo hate sayin 'uncle' !! i think i've answered, and not answered your question.

i do know that in this rural neck of the woods, there ain't a geek in sight. so i'm gonna hafta figure this one out. and since the existing progies can't do the job, this has become a reallllll challenge. i refuse to capitulate. however, i also said that when the world went from dos to windows.

hey! i've an idea. you do linux. how about a cross platform that'll dig into the bowels of windows .......and actually do what the other programs say they will....and, don't. Remove All traces of AVG8.
then, i can install kaspersky. (yes, i understand that'd be no small effort.....but it'd sure as heck be one fantastic accomplishment)

Baby_Tux · Joined: Mar 06, 2007 Posts: 1242

To use linux in such a manner would take some "programming skills" I lack. For me, it would be easier to go into the REG & delete the troublesome "booger". But for me to guide someone that isn't comfy with such things, I believe, would only be like adding salt to an open wound.

As for my questions, you did an excellent job of answering them. You even anticipated my NEXT ones.

One of the bad things an IT person runs into is situations like this that the level of knowledge on both ends isn't quite to where it needs to be to resolve the issue. It makes me sad that we (IT people) can't do any more in a case like this, as I'm almost sure that if I (or anyone else with such skills) could get our hands on it we'd be able to get rid of that little "irritation". If I happen across another way, I'll post it.

BTW: if it isn't obvious, I'm still learning too - & I've found out that the more I know, the more I know, I DON'T know!

NOTE: (an afterthought) Since you reinstalled the AVG, It MAY very well let you uninstall it cleanly this time. As that "booger" may have been a glitch in the delete the first time. - May be worth another try. - If you have an uninstall tool other than M$'s built in one, I'd use it. Be sure you have good backups just in case something goes wrong. You know, MURPHY'S LAW!

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

oy........ baby_tux, i'd murphy lawed it 3 times before runnin over to Lockergnome.

i'm thinkin that i'll go over to my daughter's to spend time with the babies.....and just happen to bring the laptop with me.

registry doesn't scare her. and, i'll take all my good stuff off that lil HP, jes in case.
*remembers teachin the youngun 'bout computers*
that was when i'd said, "here. you can have my 33mhz with the turbo button. it's got a micronics motherboard...that means it's good. and a 33K modem. you can email your Air Force hubby in Korea."

she took it, gladly. and surpassed me years ago on 'puter stuff. actually, i'd hoped i'd be able to do this, instead of turning to her. i hate to bother her with 'stuff' on her days off. she's not as good yet, as you guys n gals..... but, she's gittin close.

i'll let ya'all know if she gets it a done thing.

btw.....just because we find it in the registry, is that also going to tell us where it's been hiding? i'd think that being the case, it's location would definitely need to be added to the programs currently Supposed To Be Eliminating all traces of avg8. and, that would be a Good Thing.

goretsky · Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 5:28 am Post subject:

Hello,

Did you let Kaspersky's technical support engineers know that even after following their instructions and running the remover, the installer for Kaspersky Anti Virus still detected that AVG was present on the computer?

At this point, I would think that the Kaspersky technical support engineer you are working with could check internally with the group responsible for the logic in the installer which detects other anti-virus programs and find out what object(s) (files, directory paths, registry keys and so forth) the installer is looking for and walk you through a manual removal. Then you would be able to install the Kaspersky program.

Kaspersky does have a version which combines their anti-virus with a firewall. I do not know if that works with 64-bit versions of Windows though.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

bern · Joined: Mar 12, 2007 Posts: 1487 Location: ann arbor

This may be a bad idea, but it occurs to me that the trouble isn't AVG or Kaspersky, but the 64 bit Windows. You didn't say why you had that version. If you don't really need it for any of your applications, you could save your data, format the hard drive and start over with Win 32. Problems all solved, including games that won't play.

Baby_Tux · Joined: Mar 06, 2007 Posts: 1242

The 64 bit thing crossed MY mind as well & I've read how "troublesome" it can get at times but I think the way things are headed, that it may soon become the norm. (at least I see it moving up) so I have mixed emotions as to its use right now. Reasons to use it? - The BIGGEST thing being the memory support, if you need that much memory. (& MAYBE speed - I. E. intense graphic work) Other than that, not sure if there really IS any, at this time.

Granni, to answer your question, What I'd do (after making a backup of the reg) is do a find in the reg for "AVG" (& any other variant of a "name" they may use as a key) & DELETE those keys it finds. - & that MAY be the "gotchya", not knowing what all they may call it!

Which points me to the valid point that was made (& I'd like to know too.) DID you get back with tech support when the program failed to remove the offending files? - I assume you DID from what you posted so far. If not, I'd most DEFINITELY do so. If nothing more than it would be documented that it doesn't work so they can FIX it. & you can find out what DOES need to be removed.

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

dear gentlemen and ladies,

yes, I did correspond with kaspersky. the first contact with their support was via their site's 'contact support'...i believe that was Jan 13th. i thought ii had let them know that their 'removal program' had not removed the lingering traces of 'avg8'.
the responding email from them addressed (dear customer) the how of kaspersky to remove risk ware and malware. It literally would walk most folks through the process. However, the response did NOT address The Inability of KIS to INSTALL in the first place, due to the lingering of avg8 somewhere in the system. nor, that the removal program did NOT Work.

so, i sent them a more in depth email....describing the what and how of KIS not being able to install.

the last email i sent them was the wee hours of the morning last saturday Jan 17th 2009.......a weekend.

This morning, Jan 20th, there's an email from KIS (very nice one too) which included a removal tool for 64 bit OS.

so, my dear Lockergnome guru's........i had gone the logical route first. followed by....."if anyone can help me, it'd be the Lockergnome guys n gals".

and, You have. through our posts, i've learned (always a good thing). my neurons have been tweaked, and i've gained fresh views on the investigation of problems that crop up in our pcs........at least in mine.

re Why do i have a 64 bit: hubby bought me a laptop just before Christmas. it came with the 64 bit OS. i knew that it affected memory usuage and realized that this is the way of things to come. the net is more and more heavy graphics entrenched. so, this is really a good thing.......pc mem/resources wise.

it was in using the laptop, that i realized .... being WiFi came with it's own problems: it's a dial-up access to the net. and it creates it's own 'hot-spot', which of course necessitates ensuring that someone Doesn't jump onto 'your signal' so they can access the net.

that meant that i needed a program that would block any such attempt.

in researching, i learned more and more about kaspersky. it would handle exactly that kind of thing, AND be an anti virus And a firewall as i'd known firewalls. all in one package. sounded dang good to me.

That is how all of this began. and, yes....... it's the 64 bit, Plus the lingering traces of a 'removed program'.

do i personally need a 64 bit? nahhh. i so don't do any heavy gaming. i'm a browse and read kinda gal. but, i can see the future comin on, and that is going to necessitate processors, and virtual as well as ram, that can handle the intense graphics on the net.

my desktop is an hp 2G ram, dual processor....running XP.
the laptop came with vista and the 64 bit. i don't want to change the laptop and have to buy another OS to replace the one Paid For that came on the machine......that seems so dang counter productive, pennies-wise.

i just want the dang thing to work.......and to have the full proctection a wifi laptop needs.
comodo doesn't do 64
zone alarm doesn't do 64

Kaspersky Does do 64.........and no one would be piggy backing on my connection to the distant tower.

so, after i come back from town, i will Try Again to remove avg8 from the 64bit laptop with the removal tool that kaspersky sent me.

i'll get back to ya'all..........................

Baby_Tux · Joined: Mar 06, 2007 Posts: 1242

OK, I'm not sure if I am following you on the type of internet access you have. I'm reading both dial-up & wireless. If you have wireless, then not only will you need the stuff you are trying to put on your computer but the wireless will need to be set up properly to be secure there too. Once this is done the chances of someone "piggybacking" onto your system have been greatly reduced. (as you know, though, if someone is "hellbent" enough, they will find a way) But we'll take all this one step at a time.

One thought, as a last resort, if you have good backups, you COULD reinstall the OS, if you're up to it.

Or if the AVG is protecting things, hopefully as it should, why not just use it? If you said why you don't want to use that, I guess I missed it. Or maybe try another setup? (I use AVAST & SPYBOT S&D plus the built in firewall. Of course, my systems are 32b so not sure if you can get this in 64b.)

Baby_Tux · Joined: Mar 06, 2007 Posts: 1242

OK, I'm not sure if I am following you on the type of internet access you have. I'm reading both dial-up & wireless. If you have wireless, then not only will you need the stuff you are trying to put on your computer but the wireless will need to be set up properly to be secure there too. Once this is done the chances of someone "piggybacking" onto your system have been greatly reduced. (as you know, though, if someone is "hellbent" enough, they will find a way) But we'll take all this one step at a time.

One thought, as a last resort, if you have good backups, you COULD reinstall the OS, if you're up to it.

Or if the AVG is protecting things, hopefully as it should, why not just use it? If you said why you don't want to use that, I guess I missed it. Or maybe try another setup? (I use AVAST & SPYBOT S&D plus the built in firewall. Of course, my systems are 32b so not sure if you can get this in 64b.)

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

dear baby_tux,

the laptop is on the net via Alltell.
there is a dongle type thing that dangles from my usb port..
alltell suggested the dongle t as opposed to the internal card intallation.
I dbl click the desk icon, and it brings up the alltell connection graphic.
i click Connect and it says 'Dialling Alltell'.
in the setup is a 'dial-up' number. this in the meantime is attempting to connect to the local alltelll tower/server.
finally, the graphic says, "Authenticating".........and, i'm on the net.
or, i have a msg on that graphic that says, "remote computer not responding"......... the same thing as the days of dial-up.
i'm 'remote'. out in the toolies. the sticks. hicksville.......so to speak.

the Signal from the Alltell tower varies Greatly. and when i'm online, it seems to vary even more. from as low as a signal of 2% to a high of 85%.
with the laptop and it's 'wireless' connection...dongle' i d/l at 9 - 15.X bps. so you can imagine how long it took to finally get KIS into my download que on c:\.

The loss of signal strength is what made me think that i needed a hotspot protection included within a firewall. when i'm connected, i've just created a 'hot spot' out here in thiis lil rural burgh.

the lack of a respected firewall for a 64 bit .....one that included wifi protection in a public coffee shop spot, or out here in my own self-created hot spot is what steered me to kaspersky.
('sides, privacy protection for wifi public and private-zone is recommended on PC World web-site....AND it's home delivered monthly magazine)

add to all of that, is the fact that the windows (whichever version) OS is full of holes/vulnerabilities. I am not about to trust windows defender to block the doors.

kaspersky is just about what a firewall/anti-virus/internet-guard would be if it were called Body Guard....
when loaded it would play "i will always love you'.
and as long as i'm imagining the best that could be, when i'd click on 'about body guard'.....it'd open to show a pic of Kevin Costner.

at least that's what i think KIS is.... an almost the best. when i finally get the 30 day trial to install and open and test run it, finally i'll know.

now, i'm off to hog-tie hubby and get 'im to fess-up to where he put that lil laptop. so i can again uninstall avg8....use the removal tool for 64 bit that KIS support sent me. and, see what happens.

bern · Joined: Mar 12, 2007 Posts: 1487 Location: ann arbor

Now that I know a little about your computing environment and frustration level, there is no doubt in my mind that if I were you, that 64 bit piece of useless monstrosity would be long gone, and I would be happily running a very stable useful 32 bit XP.

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

dear bern,

i soooo do hear ;ya/
however, a lesson learned on another pc that came with vista:
we deleted vista. installed XP.
dang thing wouldn't work a lick! why? cuz the vista was tied in to the bios.
it took MANY hours to finally get XP to work...... much manual searching and d/ling of drivers. a huge pain in the derriere.

i'm not about to trust that this 64 isn't also tied to the bios, which would give me even more headaches than i already have.

here's a question (tied to the title of this thread) 64bit vrs 32.
via the posts, we all understand (me, belatedly) that it's part of the OS.
i'd asked if, somehow, the 64 could be 'turned off'.....leaving it a 32bit. or, is it also tied to the hardware: motherboard/bios/processors.

within the files it frequently refers to 32 bit. so i see this as being a dual. with my much less capish of these things than ya'all..... i also hold my thinking in reserve as an unproven.... ie., a probable wrong understanding.

granni · Joined: Jan 11, 2004 Posts: 20

ARRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

are you ready???

Warning Windows Live Hotmail has blocked some attachments in this message because they appear to be unsafe.

i emailed KIS support with the above info. and that i Can't access the 64 removal tool they sent me.

i do understand that to the bots, the removal tool may have been perceived as a 'hack' being transfered between ppls.

initially i was furious. then, i remembered what baby_tux had said:

Murphy's Law.

binar · Joined: Jan 22, 2009 Posts: 1

It is possible the avg 8 driver is hidden in the device manager.
To see this entry you will need to access device manager by right clicking my computer and select manage, then go to device manager (this is from a winXP machine, Vista will be similar.
After selecting device manager on the top go to "view" and then select show hidden devices.
in the resulting display select non-plug and play drivers.
Hopefully your version of Windows is close enough that these instructions make sense. scroll threw the entries and you hopefully will come across avg
right click it and uninstall. with a bit of luck that will be the cure.
PLEASE take all precautions prior to doing this.
Hope this helps as I have not seen this mentioned in any of the posts

Brad